Mechanical half stop

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

I know this is a strange question but does anyone have a video of a mechanical half stop like the ones on an Emmons, etc. showing how it works? I have looked at pictures of them but I can't wrap my mind around how it works without actually seeing it work.
_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Izzat the same as MSA/Bud? If so, I can shoot one tomorrow. They're kinda simple.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

Thanks, that would be great. I think they all work mostly the same way. I just can't wrap my head around it for some reason. I'm still determined to get a half stop on this Stage One. I will figure it out!!! I just love trying to solve mechanical puzzles! Very Happy

_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Tony Glassman · From: The Great Northwest

If your talking about the 2nd string lower from D# to D to C#: See the nicely done diagram below from the SGF archives. I believe it was drawn by Richard Burton.

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/userpix1205/2419_Raise1copy_1.jpg

The changer finger is held by an additional spring to the full raise position (against the body) at rest.

The full lower is tuned as is any lower, at the end plate lower screw [B].

The half stop detente is made at the point where the raise finger is lowered and contacts the lowering finger. It is tuned at the endplate screw where one normally tunes the open note. [A]

The "half stop" feel is made more noticeable by adding tension to the lower-return spring. NOTE: doing it this way, does does not allow any 2nd string raise changes.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

And here's the MSA half-stop explained. The Sho-Bud is similar, except it has a barrel on it at D.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZoVqgtGk3o
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Jim Palenscar · From: Oceanside, Calif, USA

Nice job Lane.

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Jason has a Stage One, so he is not asking about the Emmons push/pull. Nevertheless I will follow this thread as it drifts toward push/pull half stops.

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

Thanks a lot Lane. That was a tremendous help. Now I just have to design my own. But I understand the concept now. Smile

_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Why design it? For around 50 (maybe less, I don't recall), Jim Palenscar or Tom Bradshaw will sell you one, and probably have a bellcrank that will fit the Stage one.
I THINK the one I showed was Jim's (that guitar has two: one Jim, one Tom). If you have a machine shop (I don't), you might be able to rig one, but I'd rather throw money at a problem than time, if it doesn't need much money.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

The bell crank on my rkr moves toward the changer. It's pull release changer. There is only about 3 or so inches of space between the bell crank and end plate. In the video it looks like the half stop is located in the center of the guitar and the bell crank is moving away from the changer toward the center of the guitar. (All pull changer???)
_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

I think that requires someone cleverer than I. I am POSITIVE that with a reversing swivel, or another clever bit, could make it work. Either reverse something to have it push, or rejigger it to make it work on a pull.
My brain says someone could make it work, but isn't giving me answers.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

Thanks. Just seeing it work was a big help. Thanks for taking the time to video it for me.
_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Sure. Videoing the Winston book tabs that aren't on the soundsheet is proving harder. Hard to play a song you know (Silent Night is first on the list) just like someone else transcribed isn't all that easy.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

For me playing anything when there is a recording device present is a disaster!!! I can do it perfect 100000 times and try to record it and can't hit one right note.
_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Tony Glassman · From: The Great Northwest

Dick Sexton · From: Greenville, Ohio

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

Thanks Dick!! I knew someone out there was smarter than me and could figure it out! Now I just have to figure out how to make it. Or find someone who can. I knew it was possible!!
_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

richard burton · From: Britain

Is the copedent fixed, if not you can attach another bellcrank to the RKR, and use it to lower the 9th string a semitone, which conveniently becomes the half-stop for the 2nd string drop.

Have the 9th string held in the raised position, ie touching the body, by a spring.

Set the 9th string to start dropping at the exact instance that the 2nd string has dropped a semitone.

By increasing/decreasing the tension of the spring holding the 9th string in the raised position, you can alter the 'feel' of the half stop.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Richard, that might be harder to configure on a pull-release, since it'd want to release 9 first. But you know a bunch more than I about working on pull-release.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Dick Sexton · From: Greenville, Ohio

Richard, that for sure would work and would be easier then what I have drawn, but I believe on the Stage One, the bell cranks are welded to the cross rods. Not a problem for tinkerers like ourselves, but could be if the person was not pretty handy. My drawing is slightly more complicated also, to allow half stop tuning at the end plate.

Could even use an archery burger button as a half stop, for those of you that have been into archery. But that would require tuning from below. Actually anything that would present a mid travel pressure(and be adjustable) would work. I can think of a half dozen that might not be pretty. One I'm thing of, you would have to change the rubber bands about once a month to keep the pressure consistent. Lol!

Jason Putnam · From: Tennessee, USA

You are correct. The bellcranks are welded on these guitars. I can do a lot of mechanical things. But welding is not one of them. Laughing

_________________
1967 Emmons Bolt On, 1995 Mullen PRP 3x5,Nashville 112, JOYO Digital Delay, Goodrich Volume Pedal, Livesteel Strings

Forum Index > Pedal Steel		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic