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Topic: My Sho-bud tuning -- Help |
Terry Srader
From:
Georgia
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Posted 19 Nov 2003 11:59 am |
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I'm excited! I have just purchased my first "new" steel guitar... a Sho-bud LDG! I have never played PSG but am looking forward to learning it very much.
Several people here have already been a big help to me giving me advice for which I'm grateful.
Yesterday I took the "Shooby" apart and cleaned it good; it had the "Day" setup and I changed it to the "Emmons"!
My problem is that I just can't get "Shooby" tuned! I tuned the open strings w/ no problem (using Korg CA-30) but when I tune pedals / knees the open strings go flat / sharp. What am I missing?
History:
In putting the pull rods back in the fingers, i placed them so not one rod is touch another. does placement of rod in the finger affect whether knee / pedal will be "in tune"?
Is there a "best practice" for keeping the rods from touching or does this matter?
Tthanks for helping a "newbie" with those questions you've been asked a million times.
Terry
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Keith Currie
From:
Shellbrook, Saskatchewan, Canada
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Posted 19 Nov 2003 1:14 pm
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Hey Terry
My e-mail is down , as soon as they get it working I will send you a note, I think I know what your trouble is.
Keith |
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 19 Nov 2003 4:36 pm
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| Quote: |
| does placement of rod in the finger affect whether knee / pedal will be "in tune"? |
Extreamly SO
That is one of the most important parts of how far something pulls; is where the rods are on the "pullers"(Bell cranks) and what hole they are in the Fingers(where the strings hook on).
Also where the knee levers and pedals stop underneath; also determine the distance of the pull.
I wouldn't know where to start to tell you what you need to do...I haven't a clue what you have in what right now/so far?
I believe the carter site has a whole rodding chart that you may get an idea from.
I would highly suggest you get a guy near you that has done this> to come over and put the rods in correctly.
Good luck.
Ricky
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 9:24 am
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| Why didn't you just learn to play the Day setup? |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 10:35 am
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I believe your first problem might have come when you decided to dismantle your guitar and then reassemble it. Most steels that get returned to the factory or to a steel mechanic, unfortunately, are ones that were operated upon by a neophyte with a screwdriver and more enthusiasm than knowledge.
If you're a newcomer to pedal steel guitar, you most likely don't have the experience necessary to take apart a set-up, clean the parts, change it around, and reassemble with any degree of tuning success. Even a guitar as simple as a Lloyd Green needs someone experienced physically there and looking at the instrument for a correct set-up if the horn has been completely dismantled.
Duane Marrs in Nashville, Mike Cass in Nashville, Bobbe Seymour in Nashville, Bobby Bowman in Houston, or Ricky Davis in Austin are the guys I'd recommend. I'm sure there's someone in SC that might help you.
------------------
Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
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Terry Srader
From:
Georgia
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 12:01 pm
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thanks to all who have replied.
from what i'm reading, i see that this isnt an easy thing to fix, at least to the untrained eye.
i did do a complete mapping of the undercarriage prior to my taking it all apart......i will put it back to it's original config and go from there.
terry |
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Terry Srader
From:
Georgia
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 12:43 pm
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.....and thankfully, having the previous configuration documented means......it's not broke! it's just that i'll have to wait a little longer to begin learning....but wait! I'm already learning! Nothing ventured...nothing gained.
even for a newbie with some mechanical ability, i've got to admit, it's been a "great way to learn about MY guitar".
i mean, even those who work on these currently had to learn somehow, right?
motto: if not now....when? if not me....who? |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 4:18 pm
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| I say to put it back the way it was and if it works good, just learn to play the Day setup. If you have never played the pedal steel guitar, learning the Day setup as opposed to the Emmons setup shouldn't be a problem. Beats spending all that money for someone to change your setup when you don't need to. Use the money to buy some good instructional materials and accessories. |
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 20 Nov 2003 11:51 pm
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quote:
i've got to admit, it's been a "great way to learn about MY guitar".
i mean, even those who work on these currently had to learn somehow, right?
YeP; that's exactly how I learned.
I still remember waaaaay back(I bet you don't remember Herb??ha.) I took my Emmons over to my brother Herb Steiners house.
"Hey Herb; how come this 4th string won't lower anymore; I checked it all out"??
He turned it upside down...Looked at it for (I don't know>1 SECOND..ha) and said: "Cause this bell crank is broke Ricky"...
Put a new one on and was good as new.
I looked and looked and moved this and tried that...>but someone that has seen it all only took 1 second to see the prob.
That's the difference.....because as you do these things...no matter what...New problems are just around the corner...and you have to learn them...but you never will, until ALL of them have happened.
Good luck.
Ricky
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David L. Donald
From:
Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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Posted 21 Nov 2003 1:15 am
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From my expirience, with a LOT of help from Ricky, I have been re-setting my copedent.
One main point is; line up the rods and bellcranks as closely to 90 degress at each end to the changer and rod bellcrank, as spacings will allow. On an LDG it should be no problem at all.
If it's not parrallel to the other rods, you are getting a shortened distance to the changer from the bell crank and even those few mm off angle is enough to cause a slight pull on the changer when it is at rest and the tuners is adjusted.
I have had a great fight with mine to get this right. Since I am 8+8 and have a ton of stuff under there. And I have no possibility of a good PSG mechanic here, so I just had to do it and learn.
But it ain't bad now, after much diddling. I added two levers and several pulls.
Also there are the stop adjusts for when the pedal is in repose and pedal down,
these might be at different distances for A & C, so you're not getting the same return or pull distance as it was when it was set up DAY.
If pedal down is not going far enough, then you tighten the plastic tuner and when it's in repose, it is still pulling a tiny bit, but that's enough to ruin tuning.
If you loosen the stop for P down it will travel a bit farther and then you might get it in tune with the old plastic tuner setting. Too far and the pull comes late.
If you adjust the stop for pedel in repose, you may then need to adjust pedal height again.
Look at these things, and you MAY find a solution.
Always try one and not both, and check it.
But look at the mechanical action in movement several times and follow it's logic, until you understand it, before you change things.
It ain't jugglin' chainsaws and handgrenades or brain surgery, but it's not simple as just changing rods either.
And again I can't say it enough, thanks to Ricky for all his e-mail help.
He is a true Sho-Buddist, very patient with me.[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 21 November 2003 at 01:23 AM.] |
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