Standard Sacred Steeler copedent?

David Doggett · Posted 30 Jul 2003 10:46 am

I am converting a neck on a Carter D12 to a Sacred Steeler setup (the other neck is a universal). For the SS neck I have 12 strings, 3 or 4 pedals, and about 3 knee levers (LKL, LKV, LKR), maybe more if I hook up the right knee levers to both necks. I want to get as close to Robert Randolph's setup as I can get.

The trouble is that RR's setup posted at the Carter web site has 8 pedals and 5 knees. Which ones do I really need, and which ones can I forget about? Chuck Cambell also has a 12-string 8&5 setup posted there. He has the same pedals as RR, but almost completely different knees. Chuck's lower 2 strings are different, and I prefer RR's strings, I think, although I know he now plays a 13-string, probably with a low B.

Last year I watched RR play from directly overhead (there was a balcony over the stage). I got an eyeful of his hand-work, and could see his feet. He has lightening fast fingers and bar, but almost never used any pedals. So maybe it's no biggie which ones I have. I couldn't see his knees, but I have a feeling he used them as little as the pedals. Still, I'd like to have the most important ones. Does anyone on the Forum have a clue which ones they would be? Anyone actually tried any of these tunings?

Jon Light (deceased) · From: Saugerties, NY

I can't help much but I can share this tidbit--I saw RR, I forget, two or three years ago, and chatted very briefly with him. One tip he passed on after I commented on his rhythm playing--the choppin' chords thing he does--is the importance of the double E's in the low-middle of his tuning and the importance of not having the F# getting in the way. Well I'm not interested in losing my F# and it's far too important to me to put on a lever so I did it in reverse--I lower my F# to E on a lever. Although there are some uses for this as a change, the main intent was to be able to get it out of the way of a flanging, slamming thumb chop.
But the full truth is that I haven't explored that direction of playing much at all and it's sort of a back burner thing for me.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Maybe this page will help you understand it better. Here are the "essential" changes on 8 strings.

If you can set up 4 pedals and 3 knee levers, you'll have everything you need. You can add strings above and below to fill out your 12 string, but the essense of it is in those 8 strings.

The double-E tuning idea is great for rhythm playing. I've been using it for a few years now. It's a lot of fun to be able to strum majors, minors and seventh chords when someone else is taking the lead.

------------------

Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

[This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 30 July 2003 at 08:23 PM.]

David Doggett · Posted 31 Jul 2003 7:46 am

Thanks, b0b. I was hoping you'd chime in. I know you have played around with this and I've been looking at your stuff about it in the Forum Tunings section. In the 10-string version you said you ended up with, you have a couple of changes I'm curious about. Your p1 lowers the 2nd string to G and raises the 6th string to A. Why did you need those when you already had p3 raising both 2 and 6 to an A, and p5 lowering both 2 and 6 to a G? Likewise, your RKR gives you a C# on string 4 and an A on string 9, when you already have both of those on other pedals or knees. Could you explain how those are useful?

Thanks, and I hope others have some opinions. I know Dan Tyack has looked into this stuff.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 31 July 2003 at 08:50 AM.]

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

That p1 change was something I had been experimenting with on E9th for a while. It's not as useful as I had hoped, and I've since removed it.

Lowering string 9 to A is very useful for rhythm if you don't have a low G# string. It gives me a full A or A7 chord with a proper root tone for strumming.

FWIW, my current 10 string copedent isn't what is shown in the article. It's still evolving, and I haven't published my most recent changes online.

------------------

Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

chas smith R.I.P. · From: Encino, CA, USA

From a review of the Blasters at Dingwalls in London, where RR opened, printed in The Guardian:

For starters, there was a pulverising set by Robert Randolph and the Family Band, in London on their way to the Cambridge folk festival. Randolph sat centre stage behind his 13-stringed pedal steel guitar, but we could forget any notions of country music. He used the instrument to play crunching blues and howling quasi-metal, most spectacularly on a version of Jimi Hendrix's Voodoo Chile that might have had its author stroking his chin and wondering how he did it. Randolph has a new album called Unclassified, which describes his music perfectly.

David Doggett · Posted 1 Aug 2003 9:44 am

Chuck Cambell has a new CD for sale on the Carter web site, and you can sample the MP3 version on a couple of cuts. He is so smooth and precise it sounds exactly like a lead guitar in places, not like a steel or slide guitar at all. That's interesting and challenging, but not really what I'm after. I like the steel and slide sound.

Thanks for the comments on copedents. I'll report back when I try this for awhile.

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