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Topic: Tricone... Yikes! |
Kekoa Blanchet
From:
Kaua'i
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Scott Thomas
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Posted 30 Aug 2013 9:05 am Outrageous starting bid....but... |
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I have never seen a National with that kind of pattern. It is quite likely a custom job. Style 3 lily of the valley engraving with the addition of those flowers. Fascinating specimen!
The price is funny given the 1988 estimate of $3,500 by Don Young...even with inflation/crazy market. |
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Tom Snook
From:
Ft. Lauderdale, Florida, USA
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Posted 30 Aug 2013 9:36 am
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Don't forget,he's throwing in the book. 
_________________
I wanna go back to my little grass shack........ |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 30 Aug 2013 11:37 am
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Tri-yi-yi-cone!
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
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Michael Kienhofer
From:
Goulais River,Ontario,Canada
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Alan Brookes
From:
Brummy living in Southern California
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Posted 31 Aug 2013 9:16 am
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| It comes with free shipping. The way shipping costs have been rising lately someone had better grab it while they can. |
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Ben Elder
From:
La Crescenta, California, USA
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Posted 1 Sep 2013 2:57 pm
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His rationale for dating it to 1927 is more delusional than the price.
I'm not at home with my library as I fire off this riposte in militant high dudgeon. The A series may be 1936 (and there may have been more than one A-series) but I'm thinking 1930. (See the Lightning Bolt Style N "Great Acoustic" I wrote for ACOUSTIC GUITAR a few years ago. If memory serves, it also had an A-two digit serial number.) My guess is that the A in this case probably had to do with something like a limited series, special order, etc.
Look at the cover plate. Up until the early thirties, Styles 3 and 4 had flow-through engraving--i.e., the pattern continued from the body through the coverplate. This coverplate is engraved--but separately from the rest of the top...and in a different style? Is this a marriage of a Style 3 body and Style 4 coverplate? The coverplate looks to me like an unto-itself, non-catalog pattern. In any case, the earliest engraved tricones are in the Style 2 pattern. Somebody who does have access to Bob Brozman's book, look at the serial number list in the back and see if he documented it (or another close A-##) serial number.
Another big problem: pearloid headstock veneers as seen here on Styles 3 and 4 came in later (maybe by 1930?). Any 1927 (...28...29) Style 3 or 4 will almost certainly have a plain headstock with an inlaid pearl NATIONAL shield.
Another another big problem: a 1927 (and on into 1928) National would have used "stud" tailpieces--with string slots and posts so that either loop- or ball-end strings could have used. It's estimated that something like the first 500 Nationals had the stud tailpieces.
Not looking good for 1927, as far as I can tell. Looks like a custom-decorated regular production guitar (Brozman documented many such as this) from well after the company had become a going concern.
More nails in the coffin: Nationals, including the pre-production ones hand-assembled by John and Rudy Dopyera, were serial-numbered starting at 100 (not 101, according to Brozman.) The first dozens of these show evolving feaures--wooden soundwells, flat backs and, most damningly to the 1927 theory propounded by lightheadedgod76 on eBay--hand-soldered grille lattice strips. The $45000 wonder has regular-production stamped diamond grilles. Earliest prototypes also had seven diamond holes surrounding the coverplate. I'll bet the ebay tricone has a rounded back and metal soundwell to go with those stamped cutouts.
Anybody want to buy my 1944 Fender Telecaster? Transition logo, Phillips screws, maple-cap neck, s/n 2XXXXX. Just a hundred grand.
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"Gopher, Everett?" |
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Scott Thomas
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Posted 1 Sep 2013 6:06 pm
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Well, I know there are National experts (and I'm not one of them), but I do have the Brozman book. Bill, Bob's book does list some A prefix serial numbers. A13 would put this one at 1935 if it follows the normal sequence.
So, a couple of possible scenarios:
It is a 1930, which would allow room on the cover plate for the extra engraving. The top body engraving looks like variation "C" (c, 1928-30).
It's a 1935, which would argue strongly for it being a factory custom job, since body engraving "flowed through" to the cover plates by this time.
One last observation...look closely at the T-bar on the hand rest. There are engraved leaves that extend all the way across. I haven't seen that before. It seems tacked on. |
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Dale R Stiles
From:
Bradenton, FL
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Posted 1 Sep 2013 7:05 pm
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Don't be so critical guys. If you read the auction he explains:
"I will hand deliver this to the new owner, that cost is built in to the sale price."
So the guitar only costs $15,000.00 --- the remaining $35,000.00 is for private jet rental for the hand delivery.
_________________
1965 Blonde Fender Deluxe 8, Rogue Jersey Lightning, Roland Cube, Polytone Mini/Teeny Brute |
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Scott Thomas
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Posted 1 Sep 2013 9:53 pm
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You're right, Dale...this deal is looking better all the time!
There is some additional information by Mark Makin on that site Michael linked to above:
http://michaelmesser.proboards.com/thread/6518/national-style-triplate-protoype-custom
Bottom line, he too believes it's a 1930 style 3 with additional engraving done later, and that this is part of a handful of "A" series instruments separate from the Chicago "A" series with which they were erroneously grouped in the Brozman list of serial numbers (and where I got the date of 1935). |
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Alan Brookes
From:
Brummy living in Southern California
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chris ivey
From:
california (deceased)
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Posted 11 Sep 2013 8:34 am
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| i didn't realize that john dopera's wife was involved in the development of instruments. i'd only heard of his brother rudy. |
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Allen Hutchison
From:
Kilcoy, Qld, Australia
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Posted 11 Sep 2013 1:56 pm
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| Not surprisingly, the item finished without a bid! |
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