| Author |
Topic: Live strings nickle vs stainless steel test |
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 5:28 pm |
|
My 2 Millys may look different, but aside from the cosmetics, they are identical in every way. Same carbon fiber body, same neck, same copedant, and the same pickup.
I just changed the strings on both, with the new Live Strings. I put stainless steel on one and nickle on the other. Tomorrow I will compare how they sound how they feel etc. I'll report my findings tomorrow night.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
 |
Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 5:38 pm
|
|
I did that test a while back, albeit on only 1 guitar, but I have found I prefer the nickel strings better than the stainless. I had been using the stainless for many, many years and they were always my preference. I don't know if it is the fact that the Live Steel stainless aren't as good as the Jagwires and other brands I used over the years, or if their nickel strings are that much better than the others. It will be interesting to see what you come up with by having similar guitars and have the ability to test them side by side. I just ordered a set of their cryo strings. Have to see how they do.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
|
|
|
Jim Pitman
From:
Waterbury Ctr. VT 05677 USA
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 6:08 pm
|
|
Stainless steel is not permeable and nickel is. I believe all string cores are not stainless so I should say stainless steel strings have less permeable mass on the wound strings anyway.
Magnetic pickups need a permeable material to work.
Have you ever put a pickup on a nylon string classical guitar?
If you can hear it at all it is because the pickup is microphonic - responding to body vibration.
That said, I think some darker sounding guitars are brightened up a bit with stainless. |
|
|
|
Richard Tipple
From:
Ohio, USA
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 6:49 pm
|
|
I tested Live Steel, nickel and stainless ,on my Rains, a while back. Going back and forth two times with each. I went hands down with the Live Steel Stainless strings. The nickel strings sounded mellow and were fine, untill they just seem to go dead, after a week or so, where as the Stainless were brighter, when 1st put on, and have now mellowed to a point I like very much, without going dead 
I have always went with Stainless, over the years but just wanted to see for myself what nickel strings, would offer & how they would hold up as far as tone.
_________________
steelguitarguy.com |
|
|
|
Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 7:17 pm
|
|
The point about stainless being brighter is very true. My Carter can be very bright with the E66 pickup, but was tame-able with tone controls. They went dead as fast as the nickel strings IMO. I think I was just maybe in the mood for a change, but honestly, I get the same sound out of either type because I can dial in the sound I am after.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 7:36 pm
|
|
I've noticed that stainless strings still sound bright when they've gone dead. They develop false harmonics just like dead nickel strings do, but the tone stays brighter.
_________________
-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 7:41 pm I have a question.............
|
|
For years, I've used GIBSON Spanish Guitar strings on my steels. I find them superior to anything that I've every used. I also use them differently than they come packaged.
No bar friction whatsoever. |
|
|
|
Larry Bressington
From:
Nebraska
|
Posted 18 Feb 2013 7:52 pm
|
|
Black Nylon or white Nylon Ray?
_________________
A.K.A Chappy. |
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 2:44 pm
|
|
I just concluded the comparison. The stainless steel strings are on the purple one, and the nickle are on the white one.
I bypassed the volume pedal, and used the same amp, which has only one input, and the same cord. I also picked both steels at the 19th fret, so there would be no difference in tone from different picking positions.
I liked both sets. I found the difference to be very slight. The stainless steel seemed to have more of a midrange tone, while the nickle was a bit more on the treble side. But if I was talking about colors, I'd describe the difference between them as the same as the difference between light red and dark pink.
For my purposes, The more midrangy tone of the stainless steel is better. If I were playing country, I'd want the more treble sound. But ultimately the difference is so subtle that it really doesn't matter one way or the other.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
Ad Kersten
From:
Beek en Donk, The Netherlands
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 2:46 pm
|
|
Mike,
Are you planning to do the test again in 1 or 2 weeks time, to check the aging effect?
Ad
(SS strings)
_________________
Zumsteel S12U
Yo, Man! |
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 3:06 pm
|
|
Probably not. It's too hard getting them 2 in the same room. (I live on a hillside and have to climb stairs to get from my house to the street, so I keep one at home for woodshedding, and the other in the garage at the bottom of the hill so I don't have to carry it up the stairs every time I play out.)
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 3:51 pm
|
|
| Jim Pitman wrote: |
Stainless steel is not permeable and nickel is. I believe all string cores are not stainless so I should say stainless steel strings have less permeable mass on the wound strings anyway.
|
I'm not sure what grade of stainless they use on steel guitar strings, but there are varieties of stainless that have magnetic permeability, and I'd guess that's what they're using. While most austenitic varieties have too much chrome and nickel to be magnetic, there are ferritic varieties that are magnetically permeable. Anyhow, I'm pretty sure the "stainless steel" moniker applies only the wrappings on the wound strings, and that the plain strings in stainless sets, as well as the cores of the wound strings, are ordinary music wire (which may have a thin coating of a non-ferrous metal to reduce rust/corrosion). Also, let's not forget that bronze-wound strings will work on an electric guitar, even though bronze has no magnetic properties. 
Stainless sets have a "twangier" sound to the wound strings, and the wounds stay bright longer. But they also feel rough, especially when using a stainless bar. For this reason, I prefer the nickel-wrap varieties. |
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 7:17 pm
|
|
| b0b wrote: |
I don't play much on the wound strings at the 19th fret.  |
b0b, I didn't place the bar at the 19th fret, I picked the strings there. I placed the bar at the 3rd fret and slid up to the C and D chords. (I am still under Dr's orders not to mash the pedals.)
I tried this with the zirc bar. Tomorrow I'll try again with my BJS and see how they react. I'll also find a few different spots to pick the strings.
Also, a guitar player is coming over to listen and give his opinion.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 19 Feb 2013 7:47 pm
|
|
| b0b wrote: |
| Can you record this experiment, Mike? |
Maybe. I hadn't thought of doing it. It would be a big hassle, but I might be able to rig something up. If I can, I'll have to do it on a DAT. I can transfer it to cassette, but not a CD.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
Eugene Cole
From:
near Washington Grove, MD, USA
|
|
|
|
Stuart Legg
|
Posted 19 Jun 2014 6:59 pm
|
|
Mike I love most everything you do and I love the way you all play PSG and this just brightened my day.
Iβm trying to be more positive but am I the only one that noticed that this comparison of strings made a couple of times by a steel player in his home with 2 strings on 2 different PSGs could be called scientific given all the possible variances, materials and manufacture (even within the same manufacturer) two strings that will in comparison over any type or range of tests be identical.
Then of course you wonβt be able to pluck the string identically each time etc. etc.
Iβm laughing with you here and I canβt help it if it crossed my mind that the Three stooges might have approached this string test in the same manor. Just kidding!
Anyway who needs a test. The best Strings are the ones you get from the Forum no matter the brand. |
|
|
|
Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
|
Posted 20 Jun 2014 7:42 am
|
|
To my ears, I prefer nickel strings over stainless.
I had Bill Rudolph build me a steel a few years ago.
When I got it home, I wasn't too happy with the sound.
I called Bill and asked him what kind of strings he put on his guitars and he said, "stainless". I said: "That's the problem!" I put nicket strings on it and then I was happy with the sound. |
|
|
|
Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
|
Posted 20 Jun 2014 8:06 am
|
|
| I've tried many brands including stainless, nickel, other compositions, over the years since I got my Franklin, new in late 81. It came with Lawrence SS strings, which later became George L's. I keep going back to the George L's Nashville Gauges which are SS on the wound strings. I've finally got to the point no more trying other strings, I'm going to stay with the George L's. |
|
|
|
Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
|
Posted 20 Jun 2014 11:40 am
|
|
| Quote: |
| The stainless steel seemed to have more of a midrange tone, while the nickle was a bit more on the treble side. |
It's interesting that you heard that type o difference, as it (no disrespect meant - just relating history) runs counter to every other string comparison - including scientific ones using frequency analyzers, 'scopes, etc.
And I have to say my experience with stainless vs nickel plated vs "nickel wrap" on everything from pedal steels to lap steels to 6/12 strings, basses, acoustic guitars (I use only nickel strings on acoustic guitar except for a few instances of flatwound stainless)is:
Brightest - stainless
Warmest - nickel wrap
In the "middle ground" - nickel plated steel
Stainless have for years been known for more biting, treble-heavy tone, with nickel wrap having a warmer, much more "midrangy" sound.
This is regardless of pickup types (including a myriad of acoustic guitar pickups). As far a acoustics go, EB's"Not Even Slinky" and the traditional "Monel" strings are examples of suitable nickel types (Clarence White and Tony Rice are both known for use of nickel strings).
Where none of this makes a difference, however, is on plain strings. There are plain strings marketed as specially treated but other than with coated types I've experienced and read of little difference in sound between them and "vanilla" plain strings.
Body chemistry and pick attack (and on fretted instruments, fretting hand pressure) seem to be the most important factors in how long strings last - other than a good setup to avoid breakage. My own finger oils destroy Phosphor Bronze and stainless strings very quickly (I can rarely get 4 sets of playing time out of them), while nickel can last me a month on steel and 8+ sets of playing time on fretted instruments.
I tend to notice tuning issues before tonal deterioration, so my strings don't usually go "dead" - they go "bad".
OTOH, I have friends whose hands eat nickel strings and have little affect on stainless.
Anyway, I thin Mike's test, albeit an isolated instance, is interesting, and brings to mind the thought that perhaps specific pickups and/or amps react differently based on string alloys; and on steel, whether or not the bar type/plating/mass alters any particular string type's sound.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
|
|
|
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
|
Posted 20 Jun 2014 2:08 pm
|
|
I have to say one very big OOOPS. I meant to write that the nickel had more of a midrange tone and the SS was brighter. I don't know how I could have gotten that backwards. 
At any rate, I think that no 2 guitars made out of wood are absolutely identical, even if the wood was cut from the same tree. The only way to compare the different strings is to use guitars made out aluminum, or in my case carbon fibre.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
|
|
|
Les Cargill
From:
Oklahoma City, Ok, USA
|
Posted 20 Jun 2014 6:56 pm
|
|
| b0b wrote: |
| I've noticed that stainless strings still sound bright when they've gone dead. They develop false harmonics just like dead nickel strings do, but the tone stays brighter. |
I think some of it is your body chemistry. Stainless last forever for me; nickel die in a couple months.
I kinda like the slightly dead stainless strings better for wound strings. Fresh strings sound awfully edgy to me. Slightly dead ones, the notes seem to "bloom" more.
All I notice on unwound ones is the development of deadish spots. |
|
|
|
Randy Gilliam
From:
San Antonio, Texas, USA
|
Posted 23 Jun 2014 4:56 pm Stainless
|
|
I have used nickel and Stainless, I Like Stainless on the E 9th and Nickle on the C6th . The live steel strings are hard to Beat!  |
|
|
|
Bill Moore
From:
Manchester, Michigan
|
Posted 23 Jun 2014 6:46 pm
|
|
| This doesn't relate to Live Steel strings, but to the difference between stainless and nickel. I buy strings by the 12 pack, in every size that I use. A few years ago, I bought packs of stainless strings, just to see if I liked them better than the nickel strings I had been using. So, I ended up with 12 sets of stainless strings. I tried them on every guitar that I had, and in every case I preferred the sound of the nickel strings. The nickel strings were bright enough for me, without having the sharp, metallic sound I heard with the stainless. Just my personal preference. |
|
|
|
