Playing fiddle tunes (E9)

W. Van Horn · From: Houston, texas

Hey Yall,

I've been working on pick blocking scales in order to make some fast melodies a bit easier to play. I've mainly been doing exercises that I've learned on other instruments and out of books, which has been extremely helpful. However, I find that the exercises don't help as much on executing melodies as I had hoped. So, I've started transcribing bluegrass guitar hot licks and fiddle tunes to steel.

I've been finding tunes like Blackberry Blossom, Arkansas Traveler, etc... fairly easy to arrange for steel - but a lot of others have passages that I can't seem to find a smooth way of playing. For example, the B part of Tony Rice's version of Gold Rush - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0P2zYrKF-G0 . Right now I'm playing that section all out of the third fret. It seems like it would be really difficult to jump across so many strings at a decent tempo. I've tried to find more horizontal ways to play it but right now I'm at a loss. I can tab what I have if anyone is interested.

So, any ideas on playing passages such as this one? Have any of yall had success playing fiddle tunes on E9? I see steel players like PF and Doug Jernigan play a lot of speed licks and scale runs on the low strings with a lot of bar movement - any thoughts on what sort of pockets they might be working out of? Seems like horizontal playing is the key to this kind of thing.

Oh yeah, since I'm looking at this as an exercise for general playing I'm trying to avoid open strings at the moment.

Thanks for reading, and hopefully we can get a good discussion goin on this.

Nathan Emerson · From: Des Moines, Iowa, USA

Huge fan of bluegrass, if you got some good stuff please share. Wish I could help ya with your situation, still trying to find the pockets myself!
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Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

Will,

In the example the highest note is the D in the B section. I would look for that high D note on the first string at the 7th fret.I'm not sure where a good transition would be. I sometimes try not to land on the pedals down 3rd string for an important note. Not the strongest sound on the neck and I feel like I'm out of bullets when I get there.
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Clyde Mattocks · From: Kinston, North Carolina, USA

Playing fiddle tunes on steel helps your agility in executing fast passages and learning where the melody lies. This is also true on six string guitar. One of my favorite guitar exercises is playing things like Irish Washer Woman because the melody is so angular, it forces you to do unusual pick stroke reversals. The same is true on steel. You can't rely on steady one direction picking patterns. Watch Jay Dee Maness do fast stuff. He is completely at ease with all kinds of changeups.
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W. Van Horn · From: Houston, texas

Nathan - I'm going to try to post tab of what I've got so far.

Bob - I agree about the pedal down third string sounding a bit weak, and not always being a good spot to move from. I do like the idea of hitting that note on the first string and am messing around with it today.

Clyde - That's one of the big benefits I see in these tunes - each one is unique to itself and therefore presents a new set of right and left hand challenges. I've always admired Jay Dee Maness's ability to play such interesting melodies all over the neck.

I'll post a tab of what I have so far for those interested. Thanks for the replys yall.

Stephen Kuester · From: Virginia, USA

I love playing fiddle tunes on the PSG. I'm a bluegrasser, so going after fiddle tunes was just unavoidable. Those tunes teach you so much and they're so much dern fun to play. I've worked up Ragtime Annie, Whiskey Before Breakfast, Leather Britches, Blackberry, Back up and Push, East TN Blues, and Goodbye Liza Jane. Someone should tab out about a hundred or so fiddle tunes and publish them in an anthology. What a resource that would be.

Dick Sexton · From: Greenville, Ohio

W. Van Horn · From: Houston, texas

Stephen - I'm a bluegrasser too. Fiddle tunes were the first thing I tried to play on steel when I started, but it was way too hard as a beginner. I'd love to hear your arrangements of those tunes sometime.

Here's a tab of what I'm working with right now. A few things are sort of temporary
fixes - like that open string in the B section. I apologize for my handwriting - maybe I'll get some tab software. Let me know if yall have any thoughts or suggestions on this. If there's an interest in this particular tune I'll update the thread with new versions as I keep working on it.

Joseph Overton · From: Nashville, TN USA

Cool!

this is exactly what I've been thinking about. I'm a fiddler turned steel addict, and I'm just starting to get to where I can pick some melodies "fast" enough for them to be recognizable.

some of the tunes I've been playing recently are...
Lonesome moonlight waltz, chicken reel, alabama jubilee, Suzannana Gal

If anyone wanted to share tabs I'd love to get some more! ..and I could try and tab a few of these out...

Some of my favorite fiddling is really rhythmic Old time/square dance fiddling, which uses a lot of bow "pulsing" to add drive to tunes...
I've been thinking that it theoretically should be possible (after i practice for the next 50 years) to imitate some of that with the volume pedal

Henry Matthews · From: Texarkana, Ark USA

Joseph, I'm also a fiddler turned steel addict and love the old fiddle tunes on steel, however, I can only play 2 or three of them. I do Cotton Eyed Joe and Rag Time Annie and a little of Billy in the Low Ground on a good day. I find them very challenging. I heard Rany Beavers play Beaumont Rag once that just blew me away how clean and fast he could play it. Doug Jernigan also plays the fire out of fiddle tunes. I don't do or have any tabs so good luck on your hoedowns.
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Chris Sattler · From: Hunter Valley, Australia

I've just returned from my steel, sat down at the computer and read this thread. The thing is I am working on Beaumont Rag today. Ive been trying to get my head around C6 so much that I am ignoring the top neck. So I purposely just played E9 today and came up with an arrangement for this tune. I took it straight from a Doc Watson arrangement so it should be OK.
I'll post it when I've finished. First I'll have to figure out how to tab it on a computer. They are hard to play up to pace.
There are options for different passages so I tab what is easiest for me to play. Others may find a different way to play the same notes easier for them. That's Ok too

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Scott Swartz · From: St. Louis, MO

On the Tony Rice Gold Rush youtube where he slows it down starting about 1:45 I noticed a few things that could help define how to play it on on steel.

-In the first small part from 1:45 to 2:00 its mostly G major pentatonic and there is a key note to the melody that I would figure out first.

-At 1:57 there is a quick hammer on and off its an E - F - E on the guitar first string open - first fret - open. Not at my steel but I think I would want to be at 8th fret so I would do a quick move of the B pedal, 6th string for actual pitch. Actually it might make sense to move the whole melody up an octave and have that be on B pedal 3rd string, but the point is need a way to play that lick quickly and make the hammer on sound correct.

-The unisons earlier are a good opportunity to change positions

-There are good pentatonic pockets at frets 3, 5, 6, and 8 and probably end up using all of them to get both correct notes and slides and other articulations. Strings 8 7 6 5 mostly all work at these frets for quick pentatonic licks. Search "magic lick" for exampless of this.

This is great stuff to work on BTW.
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Jack Aldrich · From: Washington, USA

There's tab by Doug Jernigan in SScotty's E9 book for "Leather Breeches". I play "Ragtime Annie" - learned it while I was playing full time back in the 80's. Our fiddler loved it, including the 3rd part in G. Then, of course, there's the Orange Blossom Special, which our fiddler called "The Old BS". - Jack
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Jack Aldrich · From: Washington, USA

There's tab by Doug Jernigan in SScotty's E9 book for "Leather Breeches". I play "Ragtime Annie" - learned it while I was playing full time back in the 80's. Our fiddler loved it, including the 3rd part in G. Then, of course, there's the Orange Blossom Special, which our fiddler called "The Old BS". - Jack
_________________
Jack Aldrich
Carter & ShoBud D10's
D8 & T8 Stringmaster
Rickenbacher B6
3 Resonator guitars
Asher Alan Akaka Special SN 6
Canopus D8

Stuart Legg · Posted 29 Mar 2013 12:34 pm

first 2bars Gold Rush

chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

doug jernigan has been playing fiddle tunes on steel since before the ancient era of 'hillbilly jazz' with vassar. no one does it better. no one comes close to doug's effortless playing. he is a god!

John H. McGlothlin · From: Raton, New Mexico

I first heard The Orange Blossom Special on steel guitar for the first time on a Doug Jernigan record "Up Town To Country" and that gave me the idea to practice fiddle tunes on steel. Here is one of my versions of the song. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_p6EWflk3o&list=UU30DN-Fmn1VIawdBWwTtigQ&index=8
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chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

you're a brave man, john.

what makes doug jernigan's approach so awe inspiring is his command of lightening fast, clean chromatic picking, not to mention his ability and knowledge of notes on the fretboard. and his effortless smiley delivery.

not by any means the best i've heard from him, but an indication.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP8YbVus_TE&feature=player_detailpage

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