I bought the Clark Custom on eBay PICS ADDED

Gary Patterson · From: Gallatin, TN

Members here usually spy on eBay transactions and offer their cheers and jeers, but this one must have slipped by.

My "new" Clark arrived today. Serial No. 165. It's beautifully built, both woodwork and metal. It's missing a pedal rod connector, so I can't quite play it yet, and a couple of pulls seem sticky, so I'll clean it up and tweak it in days to come.

Here's a mystery, though: It's 2 pedals and 5 KLs. I figured it was missing a pedal, but, no, it was made this way, apparently to the buyer's specification.

Does anyone know why a player would omit the C pedal? The "C" pull is not on any of the KLs, either.

Daniel Policarpo · Posted 25 Jan 2013 4:44 am

That's a beauty! As far as the number of pedals and levers, I always think about Don Warden and the one pedal he used with Porter Wagoner as a Wagoneer and how much mileage Lloyd Green gets out of 3/4. I suppose the player was experienced enough to know what they wanted. I take it the seller was not the last player?

Bob Hickish · From: Port Ludlow, Washington, USA, R.I.P.

Gary
I can see where one might not have a “C” pedal - in a recent post it was discussed -- by b0b i think -- putting that change on a “V” lever -- I did it to my Fender highbred and like the way it works --- I know you said it’s not on a KL -- but its a way to get that change if you want it

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

I rebuilt an S-10 Emmons p/p a while back that only had 2 foot pedals. I put the 3rd pedal on it, though.

Herb Steiner · From: Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064

Bobby Bowman's D-10 setup only has 6 pedals and 4 levers, and he plays wonderfully. No "C" pedal on his E9 either.

Just a minor POI to Daniel: Porter Wagoner's band was the Wagonmasters. Wink

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Jim Pitman · From: Waterbury Ctr. VT 05677 USA

That's a bute!
I have to admit for years I didn't do much with that 2 minor chord you can get by pressing the C and B together. Now I'd miss it though, perhaps more for the harmonizing duad scale you can get with it. Six months ago I added a forth way to get a minor - no. 4 pedal of 8 now flat the thirds. I find I only use this to transition a major to minor chord quickly or play a duad scale once again.
Gary do you know what kind of changer system it has?
- all pull scissors, push pull, pull release, rack and barrel to name a few.
I'm intrigued lately with the Kline design - an all pull rack and barrel whereby the stops are located at the end plate not at the pedal rods. - wicked repeatable and not so affected by temperature.

Gary Patterson · From: Gallatin, TN

Jim, it's an all pull design of some sort, but the pedal tuning is done via stop-screws in the endplate, not the typical nylon nuts.

I'm adding some under-side pics for the mechanics among us. To my eye this is a pretty elegant system, but I haven't completely figured it out yet.

I was alerted to the fact that Jim Clark is still (or again, more correctly) in biz, and called him. He couldn't have been more friendly or accommodating in supplying me with parts I need to add the third pedal!

Jim Pitman · From: Waterbury Ctr. VT 05677 USA

That looks alot like the Kline Rack and barrel.
Two advantages I see with the stop being at the end plate:
1. It likely counteracts cabinet detune unlike a stop at the top of the pedal rod - appears to be true on the Kline BTW.
2. Since there is no rod length between the changer and the stop, temperature change is not as much of a factor.

mike nolan · From: Forest Hills, NY USA

Good looking Axe.

J R Rose · From: Keota, Oklahoma, USA

The Clark is a super well made steel and Jim Clark has never been given the credit he deserves. His changer is very good and dependable. It is a lot like the ZB Steel design but neater and cleaner.
And yes, the allen screws pull up to the end plate for a positive stop. If I had seen the ad I would have jumped all over it. Hope you enjoy, J.R.

Neil Harms · From: Ionia, Missouri, USA

So anyone but me really interested in seeing Bobby Bowman's D10 setup? Color me intrigued....

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

The mechanism reminds me of a ZB.
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Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

That's because it was directly copied from a ZB. Zane Beck was none to happy about it.

Jan Viljoen · From: Pretoria, South Africa

I found this 33 page old ZB/Clark reference of 2002, because there is so much I have to learn.
Apparently Messrs Clark and Beck were good friends.

http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum5/HTML/004696.html
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Tony Glassman · From: The Great Northwest

Beautiful guitar.very. I'd love to hear it.

Gary Patterson · From: Gallatin, TN

Well, I gathered some parts and began to make my "preferred" changes: Add a third (C) pedal and reverse the A & B for a "Day" configuration. As I studied the existing rod configuration, I saw that the RKR was set to raise string 4 E to...F#. It dawned on me that by adding this to the A pedal down, I'd have the C pedal change (+ a C# on 10.

I tried this out for a lick or two and found that this eliminates the need to lift the pedals for a transition from A+B to B+C.

Does anyone have experience or opinions about this setup? I'm just a rank above rank beginner. Should I leave this alone or continue modding this guitar for a more conventional copedant?

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

That explains why the guitar only has 2 pedals.

I used that E to F# knee lever for many years, sometimes with a C pedal, sometimes without. I still have the equivalent change on LKV of my D6th tuning.

The main disadvantage is that it's not as fast as using a pedal for uptempo country music. Also, you'll have to forgo one of the more standard knee lever changes to have it. Seems that there's always a tradeoff.
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Keith Howard · From: London Ohio, USA

Gary,
I too bought a Clark on eBay (about 6 months ago). It is a D-10 and had the E to F# raise on Right knee right. Was kinda cool but I couldn't hit some of the stuff that I had learned with the B C pedals.

On my D-10, the 3rd pedal (C pedal) was actually rasiing something on the C6 neck and doing nothing on the E9 neck. I tore it all apart and set it up as a conventional Emmons copedent. Required quite a bit of work and I had to machine a few parts but I'm glad I did it.

Also, the guitar had sat in a closet for years and was very "stuck". The old lube had collected dust and dried up and nothing was moving right. Even the pedals had a high amount of drag (or resistence) which required pulling everything apart and a good cleaning.

Once I put it all back together and fiddled with adhjustments for several days... it was well worth the time and trouble. Incredible tone and sustain.

It just got easier and easier to play for the next several weeks and now requires little to no tweaking.

Stay with it, Mr Clark built some FINE sounding (and playing) guitars.

Gary Patterson · From: Gallatin, TN

Keith, thanks for your input. I agree this guitar is well built and sounds great, to the extent that I can play it. Mine, too, was a bit bound up with old lube, and I've made good progress in freeing it up.

I'm inclined to proceed with my C pedal addition (thanks to factory parts supplied by Jim Clark!)

Tell me: when you set up your pedal, how did you arrange your B-C# raise? Were you able to use a second raise hole in the changer, or was it necessary to rig up a "pass-thru" rod so the raise could be activated by either A or C pedal? If you have a photo or diagram, I'd love to see it.

Keith Howard · From: London Ohio, USA

Gary,
I'll try to get you some pictures today. Guitar is set up where we record and I'm not there right now. As I recall, I used a "pass through" rod on the B to C# change. In my case, there we're multiple copedent changes needed to get the guitar to what I was used to playing. I ended up robbing parts from the C6 neck to complete the E9. Also had to fabricate a few parts in my shop.

I see that you have 3 tunning screws on the end plate for the fourth string. One for lowering the E, One for rasing it with the knee lever and the third for the "C" pedal raise. Interesting that Mr Clark built this in even though the original buyer did not want a "C" pedal.

I've attached a picture that I had on my computer of front of the Clark.

Keith Howard · From: London Ohio, USA

Gary,
What is the vertical knee lever doing?

Gary Patterson · From: Gallatin, TN

Keith, that green finish is stunning! Maybe the lighting in your photo, but the maple figuring is much more distinct than on my dark red.

The vertical was rigged to raise string 1 to G and drop string 6 to G. I have the first-string to G on my other guitar, but haven't found much use for it, so I've removed the Vertical for now.

That third tuning screw on string 4 is needed, even without a C pedal. The RKR raises to F#, but two other KLs raise to F and lower to Eb. I haven't quite figured out how to retain that function when I remove the F# raise from the KL and assign it to the C pedal. The RKR bellcrank has a stop which acts on that third rod. To tell the truth, I know what this system does, but darned if I know how it does it. You can't quite see it in this photo, but behind the bellcrank is a "pass-thru" bushing with a shaft collar, such that when the F-raise lever is pulled, the shaft collar "partially" pulls the F# raise to F. You can see the other end of that pull rod at the far right of the photo.

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