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Topic: guitar wood |
Tony Williamson
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 10 Mar 2012 8:25 pm |
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| why do i not ever see steel guitars made of walnut, or really pretty walnut veneer like burl or fiddleback over maple? my stelling staghorn and masters cross banjo's have beautiful walnut wood. a steel guitar would be beautiful in walnut. You could even have quilted maple inlays like my stelling. just wondering.... |
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David Beckner
From:
Kentucky, USA
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Posted 10 Mar 2012 9:02 pm
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Tony
I had a discussion with Bob Simmons ( Simmons Steel Guitars) about this very subject a while back.Most Walnut is more expensive as compared to Maple or die board that most guitars are built of . Also walnut tends to be heavier than other woods making it somewhat of a negative as well..There are other woods out there such as pecan, cherry etc that have nice tones and grains to them but they are somewhat shunned by music instrument builders due to them being notorius for cracking and splitting.
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http://www.dbupholstery.yolasite.com |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 12:45 am
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| Given the stress that ten to twenty-four strings can put on a piece of wood the propensity for cracking and warping is a serious consideration, and very few people want a guitar that is any heavier than it has to be. Since the lightest single-neck guitars weigh in at 50 lbs. or more there is not much of an argument for using the heavier woods. |
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Tony Williamson
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 6:26 am
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| i guess all that is true, but there is hardly any wood prettier than fancy walnut. if veneered it looks like the stress would be on the underlying maple which is rock strong. my banjo resonators are veneered over maple i think, anyway, just a thought though. it might even look kinda funny because we are so used to seeing maple and mica. like seeing a banjo out of english walnut or something. |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 6:32 am
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| Quote: |
| Since the lightest single-neck guitars weigh in at 50 lbs. or more... |
The lightest single-neck guitars weigh more like 30 lbs., and around 40 lbs in the case.  |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 8:26 am
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No reason Walnut wouldn't work pretty well. It's actually usually lighter in weight than hard maple. Claro or California Walnut is even lighter. I use it for acoustic guitars sometimes and it can be really great as a tonewood. It's extremely stable in terms of warping and cracking. It's been used for gun stocks for centuries. I have a nearly 120 year old bolt action rifle with French walnut stock and it's as fine and straight as the day it came out of the factory. It was used extensively on banjos from the late 1800's. I've seen plenty of old necks that have held up beautifully.
One thing that's a consideration is finish. Maple is a joy to finish because it doesn't have any open grain that needs the extra step of pore-filling and the extra coats and sanding to level the lacquer finish. Also, beautifully figured maple is much more common than highly figured or burled Walnut - though I absolutely agree that it's some of the most beautiful wood there is.
I think it would be interesting to use alder veneered with walnut. I think you'd have to reinforce the body against string pull and cabinet drop, but it would be nice and light and the tone should be really great.
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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Clyde Mattocks
From:
Kinston, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 8:37 am
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We built a couple of Walnut steels (Cherokee). One of the best sounding Cherokees I had was a Walnut one. They are heavier and harder to clear coat finish because of the openness of the grain. You have to use a paste filler. I have a Walnut Harlow dobro that I love and a Walnut 335 Gibson electric. I think Walnut is an excellent tonewood.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro |
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 9:33 am
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"I have a nearly 120 year old bolt action rifle with French walnut stock and it's as fine and straight as the day it came out of the factory. It was used extensively on banjos from the late 1800's. "
You only shoot old banjos? No new ones? |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 10:11 am
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| Quote: |
| The lightest single-neck guitars weigh more like 30 lbs., and around 40 lbs in the case. |
No doubt you are correct, Donny. What I can say specifically is that my little S10 Pro I is only 3+2 but I have to take the VP out of the case every time I check it at the airport to get it down to 50 lb. I know ShoBuds are not known for being all that light but there's not much left to trim on this one and all of the formica guitars I have seen are even heavier... |
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Kirk Eipper
From:
Arroyo Grande, Ca.
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 10:22 am
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here is my 2010 Williams. It has walnut front and rear aprons and neck, the top deck is maple and the guitar is very light.
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'10 Williams 700 Series SD10 4+5/ '71 Emmons S-10 3+4/ '73 Emmons D-10 8+4/ GK MB 200/ Custom Tommy Huff Cabinets/ Webb 614-E/ Steelseat.com Pak-a-seat/ Magnatone and Fender lap steels/ Cobra Coil bars & Strings/ pod 2.0/ Peterson Tuners/Goodrich V.P./ Boss RV5/Teles and Martins
www.kirkeipper.com |
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Rich Peterson
From:
Moorhead, MN
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 11:40 am
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| John Allison wrote: |
I think it would be interesting to use alder veneered with walnut. I think you'd have to reinforce the body against string pull and cabinet drop, but it would be nice and light and the tone should be really great. |
Perhaps embeding carbon fiber rods, as is commonly done with upper level electric bass necks. |
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Marvin Born
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 11 Mar 2012 11:45 am
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I have an Emmons Push Pull that has a mahogany body with a maple veneer. It has a Sunburst finish.
The sound is not as bright as a maple Push Pull with the same type of pickups.
Marvin |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2012 6:12 am
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| John Billings wrote: |
"I have a nearly 120 year old bolt action rifle with French walnut stock and it's as fine and straight as the day it came out of the factory. It was used extensively on banjos from the late 1800's. "
You only shoot old banjos? No new ones? |
The older ones fly better...
PULL! 
_________________
John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2012 6:28 am
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| Rich Peterson wrote: |
| John Allison wrote: |
I think it would be interesting to use alder veneered with walnut. I think you'd have to reinforce the body against string pull and cabinet drop, but it would be nice and light and the tone should be really great. |
Perhaps embeding carbon fiber rods, as is commonly done with upper level electric bass necks. |
That's a thought I had, also and I might go one further and put 2 or 3 light compression rods to counterbalance string tension. The added weight would be negligible and adding static tension to the system really has an effect on the transfer of energy. When we're stringing up a new acoustic guitar, it's amazing to hear the difference in power and tone with the truss rod a little loose and with it fully tensioned.
I have an 8- or 9-string project in the planning stages and I might have to consider a build like this. Somewhere around the shop I have a stack of gorgeous burled walnut veneers and I keep alder around for electrics and non-pedal bodies.
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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Rich Peterson
From:
Moorhead, MN
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Posted 12 Mar 2012 7:31 am
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I have encountered a couple solid body electric guitars made with paulownia, also known as Princesswood in Japan and Empresswood in China. It is extremely light but strong, greater strength per weight than balsa. Nice grain pattern. And both guitars were very resonant with a clear ringing sustain.
It has me wondering whether these reenforcement strategies would make it suitable for a steel. |
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John Allison
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2012 6:19 pm
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I've seen Pawlonia, but never used it for anything. It seems like an interesting wood. Another great wood is Spanish Cedar. Extremely light, very resonant, relatively inexpensive, but unfortunately very soft and easily dented. There Canadian Cypress, to - not quite as light, but much harder. For that matter, good old quartered Sitka Spruce would make an incredibly "toneful" guitar.
There are plenty of reinforcement schemes that will yield a very stiff body. I'd say that Spruce with a thin carbon fiber shell would be about the stiffest, lightest lay-up you could hope for.
One thing you'd have to consider with a PSG, though, is that there's a lot of hardware screwed into and bolted through all that wood. You still need something that will resist compression and provide grip for any wood screws that might be used.
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John Allison
Allison Stringed Instruments
Austin, Texas
www.allisonguitars.com |
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Eugene Cole
From:
near Washington Grove, MD, USA
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Posted 12 Mar 2012 6:57 pm
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Walnut solid or vaneer could be used. The question is whether it would be chosen by clients.
Walnut would certainly be prettier that the Mica which seems to appear on many PSG's.
I have played a few 6-string guitars over the years that had walnut back and sides. One of them was way to btight sounding. but it was overbuilt in many ways.
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Regards
-- Eugene <sup>at</sup> FJ45.com
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Sierra U14 8+5 my copedent, 1972 MSA D10 8+4, and nothing in the Bank. 8^) |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 14 Mar 2012 1:56 pm
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I think most of the maple use is by tradition, these days, and done for looks. I guess that 40-50 years ago, it could be argued that there was some "essential" resonant component that the wood added to pedal guitars. Of course, these were the days of simple guitars and simpler setups. As manufacturers continued to add metal to the guitars, most of the requirement for using "tone wood" simply went away, IMHO. Acoustic guitars require resonance to make them project a reasonable volume, but electronics really negated all that with the coming of solid and semi-solid bodied guitars. I've often commented that pedal guitars, with their heavy changers, crossrods, rod supports, thick necks, their plethora of pull rods, pounds of hardware, and the massive headstocks and tuners, really exhibit very little real resonance or "ring". They are really a different animal that acoustic guitars, because the emphasis nowadays is on sustain. The more the instrument body vibrates, the more sustain is robbed from the vibrating string. Acoustic guitars "ring", whereas pedal guitars go "thunk", and I feel the many successful pedal guitars that have no "tone wood" bear that out.
Little wonder that the banjo, arguably the loudest of all compact acoustic stringed instruments, has so little "sustain". |
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