need slide advice

David Innerebner · From: Wisconsin, USA

I have been playing slide (lap style) since december '11. I started out with a light weight slide i had. To get better tone i bought a Dunlap slide, the kind that fits over your finger, but I still used it by pinching it between my index finger, middle finger and thumb. Then I saw some you tube videos and saw the control that guys had with a dobro grooved style slide and bought one. The finger slide was too bulky for the kind of control I want to practice.

The problem is that the new slide is alway slipping out of my grip if i raise it up on an angle to use it on one sting, It just slips through my grip.

Anybody got any tricks to a better grip. The thing just slips even when I find my self gripping harder ultimately making it very hard to use.

Am i the only one?

thanks
dave

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

There aren't any tricks to goofing around with a steel guitar, you make your own rules.
However, should you decide to learn how to play STEEL GUITAR in a proper manner with a STEEL BAR then you can get all the help you need from forum members.

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

I really hate the reference "SLIDE" or "SLIDE GUITAR" when one is referring to an electric Hawaiian Steel Guitar. Gee's! It kinda reminds me of what Rock & Roll has done to old country........ Sorry for the rant!

Ron has made a good comment for you to really consider.

Down thro' the years, I've heard of fellows squirting this kind of stuff or that on their hands/fingers, in order to make their hands sticky and thus make it easier to hang onto the bar.

I've found after a few years of playing steel guitar that one simply should NOT wash ones' hands immediately prior to going to play as the soap or conditioner often makes the hands extremely slippery.

I simply go to a gig, with the normal, daily grind on my skin and have never had a problem with bar control. I do forward and reverse slants without difficulty. It's worked for me for a long, long time.

Chris Gabriel · From: Oregon, USA

Just gotta practice man. I've got a 1 year old, and she likes to crawl around my feet... if I drop the bar, it might hit her on the head! That's an incentive not to drop the bar ... True story, freaks me out when I watch her, maybe that's bad? Oh well, i hold that bar pretty good. Im sure you'll get the hang of it. Just don't give up, ey?
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Kevin Greenberg · From: Lakewood, CA

You are not the only one. Dropping the bar is part of learning steel guitar. Make sure your hands are not oily, greasy, or slippery. Soap(as mentioned), lotion, lotion treated tissues, food, oil, grease, oily skin, etc. can cause this. If you need to wash your hands before you play, PLAIN dish soap is the best thing to wash your hands with. With no moisturizers or lotions in it. Like green Pamolive. Rinse very well and dry well afterwards. Try a different bar (slide) out as well, to see if you have the same problem. And as mentioned, practice, practice, practice. If all else fails, go down to your local skateboard shop and get some grip tape. Put it on the sides of the bar, in the side cut-away grip area where you hold it.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

I think the major part of his problem is he doesn't know what/how to practice anything but bad habits and incorrect tech. Using a hollow slide or a dobro bar is hardly the way to get the full use of the steel guitar. It's kinda pointless to give advice on such an unfocused venture. If someone is going to halfass it then they are going to suffer the limitations and inevitable consequences. It's like trying to play an instrument with your butt, good luck!

Bobby Snell · From: Austin, Texas

Seriously? The new guy gets a ration of c%&p because he uses the wrong terminology? Dares to experiment with unapproved equipment?

George Piburn · From: The Land of Enchantment New Mexico

Hello from MR.Boards

Bar Control Movie << Click << This should give at least some insight about using a Round Nose Bullet Bar.

Getting to know what a Round Nosed Bullet Bar is all about and how to use it is the beginners greatest challenge, and is worth the effort and determination for the endless rewards.

Every thing you are doing so far is very typical of some one wanting to cross over into Steel Guitar Playing. You have entered a family of people who are dedicated to Steel Guitar and it's details. Terms like Slide relate to Bottle Neck style, as you meet the mentors in this group of opinion givers they will be guiding folks to the use of traditional Steel Guitar "Bars" aka "Tone Bars".
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Former Member · Posted 20 Feb 2012 7:21 am

Here's a guy that plays the HECK out of Hawaiian tunes with the same bar you're using.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7m_HkYEohI4
This all started with a railroad spike, and pocket knives and such.....Then Jerry Byrd came along and pretty much wrote the book, literally.
http://www.well.com/~wellvis/jbyrd.html
I have some trouble holding the bar also..and recommend the "JB" bar from Tribotone.
http://www.tribotone.com/bars.html
Just keep practicing!!!

John Allison · From: Austin, Texas, USA

Dave, you've stumbled into a whole new world. If you're serious about learning steel guitar or dobro - as opposed to "slide guitar" - you'll find that there's a lot to process.
Figure out what style you want to play and seek out the proper equipment and technique. Bar control is a big deal and there really aren't any shortcuts...and right hand technique can be even more involved. George has provided an excellent place to start and there's a lot more material available. Just be patient and keep at it.
And, yes, the Tribotone bars (http://www.tribotone.com/) are amazing for helping with grip and feel, not to mention the positive effect on tone.
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Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

David Innerebner · From: Wisconsin, USA

Well I guess I stumbled in to a hornets nest. Do not know whether to laugh it off or think I came to the wrong place.

So, I picked up steel guitar because I stumbled upon a 1951 electric lap steel guitar that needed some work. It peaked my interest.

I tuned one of my acoustics to an open G and started messing around. Watched some YouTube and came across guys playing open G in a Keith Richards style and a "slide style" and then saw some guys play in a lap steel style. It was INSPIRING (A few of you please take note, inspiration wins the day not assholeism). I played around with that the first time ever for a few weeks LAST DECEMBER. I tuned another acoustic to open D and started playing around with that. In February (this year,two weeks ago) I fixed the 1951 lap steel to mess around, and love it.

I also got nut extenders for the two acoustics. Totally loving it. (One tuned to open D, the other G tuned with a low E, I am a fan of minor 7ths) I realized I needed some help with bar advice because I was using slides. When I bought the dobro bar it was falling out of my grip. Hence my reason for asking those in the know. I am playing steel for three months now.

I appreciated the help here. I have in my life (48 years)(41 0f which I have been a musician) come across hard nose teachers that can instruct and challenge, and of course people who can encourage and demonstrate the art and at times ass hole musicians who are stuck on themselves and their art. It take all kind.

I am going to try the bullet bar it seems to me it is what I am looking for. Though I want keep working with my STevens bar too. I stumbled across Andrew Winton. Very inspiring and seems like a good teacher. He embodies a style I would like to learn. I will also check out some of the advice I received here with other bars.

thanks everyone even you Ray Montee and Ron Whitfield
(catch you on the slide)

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

You are deffinitely in the right place, Dave, and I think if you can weather a few assoholics you'll reach whatever goals you seek.
And while we can appreciate all types of styles and ways of creating music, there is decades of proven and approved ways of getting the most out of the steel and yourself. With that, it's obvious when someone comes in with techniques that are mostly kept in a small side drawer and left to those rare moments when standard steel techs don't fill the bill. So feel free to get it on and get the most out of this thing, we're not the enemy. Just don't call a Bakelite a panda.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Andrew Winton
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKnngyCIctA

Pretty good stuff by Andrew, but there's a whole world beyond that style to be had on the steel.

David Innerebner · From: Wisconsin, USA

Thanks Ron that you tube video of Andrew is the same one that inspired me. When I saw it, I made it my goal to learn that song.

John Mulligan · From: Ontario, Canada

Hi David; I started out as a Muddy Waters fan who stumbled onto Harry Manx, seen here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VO73Fczq9IM. That got me inspired to start playing lap style. Now I have two lap steels, one I keep tuned to open E and the other to Don Helms six string version of E13. I try to play blues on the E tuning and everything else on the E13. I'm working on country and swing related stuff as well as trying to play standards like Ain't Misbehavin. It's an adventure, and lots of fun. Welcome, and enjoy!

Thomas Temple · From: Florida, USA

Dave,
There are a lot of really talented/professional players in this forum and many have years of experience behind them and while I am sure that they are trying to impart their wisdom to you some times they forget that there are a lot of newbies that have problems with some of the basics, ie: which slide is easy to hang on to. So being a fellow newbie and having tried a lot of different slides the ones that I find are the easiest to hold on to and use are my Shubb-Pearse SP-1 and SP-2 models. There are purists that look down on these, but because they have and indentation and a "bullet" nose they sure filled the bill for me. Hope that you find one that is comfortable for you and BTW welcome.

Tom

Frank James Pracher · From: Michigan, USA

I just wanted to put in a recommendation for Paloma Tone bars. My hands sweat so much (especially when I play out) that keeping the bullet bar in my hands is real tough, even keeping a Stevens style bar under control can be taxing.
The Paloma bar that I use has a Stevens style grip on the side and a rounded "bull nose". The top where you finger rest is unglazed and no mater how much my hands perspire I can always keep it under control.
They have a tone that's a little different from steel. I actually like it a little better.

Here is a link to Paloma Stone Slides.

http://www.stoneslides.com/home
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Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Chris Walke · From: St Charles, IL

David Innerebner · From: Wisconsin, USA

WOW, Love the feel of Henry Manx, thanks for the tip.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Chris Walke · From: St Charles, IL

No, plenty of good, encouraging advice already offered. Nothing to add. My point being, you're first two responses included the post I referenced and this:

"There aren't any tricks to goofing around with a steel guitar, you make your own rules.
However, should you decide to learn how to play STEEL GUITAR in a proper manner with a STEEL BAR then you can get all the help you need from forum members."

And then you accuse Bobby of scaring away the new guy. So yeah, I chastised. Guess we're all assoholics here.

Paul DiMaggio · From: Fort Nelson, British Columbia, Canada

Here is what I found worked for me,David,which ever tone bar you choose,bullet or Stevens type,carry it around with you, to get used to having it in your hand.Practice slanting it on a table ,desk,car seat or your knee.If it is a bullet bar hold it with your palm down like you were playing until you figure out how to hold unto it.I believe Mr. Georgeboard's video shows that.
As for which bar to use ,well, resonator players tend to use the Stevens bar and electric lap and pedal steel players tend to use bullet bars. Having said that,Brother Oswald used a bullet bar on his Dobro,and Kayton Roberts uses a Stevens bar on his Fender D8.
Try out as many as you can of both types and decide which one fits you best.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

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