Hi! I'm new!

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Hi everyone. I am very new to the pedal steel community. I've always loved the sound of the instrument and have obsessed about buying one for quite some time. It is a terrifying field of music to get into. I am currently looking to buy my first pedal steel, but I will get into that further down.

My musical background has been the rhythm section for some time. I started when I was young, playing drums. I play electric and upright bass now in an "indie" band. I've played bass and guitar almost as long as I can remember, and dabble in the mandolin and lap steel guitar. I like playing the lap steel, but feel incredible limited to what it can do.

The most familiar pedal steel player I listen to on a regular basis is Mike Mogis of Bright Eyes and Monsters of Folk. I've also been liking the steel playing on Bry Webb's new album. I would love to listen to some variety, who else should I be listening to?

Sooo, that's my introduction.

In terms of buying a pedal steel, I have to ask you all for your opinions, Ive been looking around quite a bit at some models:

Carter Starter (around $850? used)
Stage One (about $1000 new)
GFI Student Model (about $1200 new)
Sho Bud Maveriks (eBay around $800 used)
Wilcox SD-10 (2010) ($1100 like new)
BMI S-12 (4 and 5) ($1400 used)

What should I be looking into more seriously? I read that the Wilcox's were made only okay back a few years ago but the production has gotten much better. DOes anyone have any experience with the newer ones?

I hear nothing but good things with the Stage ones and the Carters are lesser to them. The GFI student model looks pretty sound but I have been talking with a dealer near where I live and he tells me they are limited for the cost.

The BMI I've been looking at is at the much upper part of my budget for a pedal steel.

What are your suggestions for a steel that I will want to keep playing and not have very many issues with? Am I on the right track with this list? Should I avoid most vintage builds? Is a all pull system better for a new guy than a push pull?

Thank you in advance!

Bent Romnes · From: London,Ontario, Canada

Hi Sandro,
Welcome, another Ontarian to the SGF!
In your quest for a pedal steel, I just wanted to make you aware of the BenRom SD10 that I build. You can see and hear it on the website listed below. If it should spark your interest, email me either through this forum or in Contact on the web site.
Dealing with a Canadian builder lets you avoid heavy import duties - and more. You also have the builder handy for tweaks and touch-ups if it should ever be needed.
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BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Sandro, whatever you buy, make sure that it has 4 knee levers. Don't get anything with fewer than that.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin

Matthew Schwartz · From: Kalamazoo, Michigan, USA

I've had my Stage One now for just a few months and I love it. It's easy to play , great tone , and very light weight.
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Black Stage One Steel, White Pearloid Rogue Jersey Lightening Lap Steel, Rogue EA-3 Lap Steel, Epiphone EJ-200CE, Parkwood PW370M

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Thanks for the replies already. I like that this community is very active.

With four knee levers....is that just so that I get used to it right away?

And Bent, I sent you an email about your pedal steels.

Matthew, How do you find the Stage One in terms of build? Is it pretty solid? How about the case?

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Ben-Rom looks really nice but I've never seen one up close.

Stage One would be excellent.

Maverick and Carter Starter would be OK at $200 or less; otherwise probably not.

And you don't need 4 knee levers now.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

I'd get four or five knees to start with, so you won't get the frustration of having to upgrade or replace your guitar in a year or two.
But if you choose instructional materials aimed at your skill level, it'll be a little while before you'll use a second one, let alone all 4.
I figure it's better to have them and not have a use for them than the other way 'round.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

I agree with Mike P. on this one.

If you stick with the pedal steel, you're sooner or later going to want at least three knee levers--very few players use fewer than four--so why have to go through the trouble of adding levers later?

And if you don't stick with the pedal steel, you'll probably be selling it, and, given the above, a guitar with four knee levers will be considerably easier to sell.

(Lane and I were typing at the same time.)

Ray Anderson · From: Jenkins, Kentucky USA

I play a Sho-Bud and the cost for levers and their setup hardware runs about $150.00 a kit. So with that in mind you can add that to the cost of the steel that does not have them. and belieive you me if it gets hold on you, the other levers are a must. Even if you don't need them right away, you can always noodle around with them and find some discoverys on your own. Go all out! I made this miscalculation and regreted it. Wink

Welcome to the forum.

Ray Anderson · From: Jenkins, Kentucky USA

I play a Sho-Bud and the cost for levers and their setup hardware runs about $150.00 a kit. So with that in mind you can add that to the cost of the steel that does not have them. and belieive you me if it gets hold on you, the other levers are a must. Even if you don't need them right away, you can always noodle around with them and find some discoverys on your own. Go all out! I made this miscalculation and regreted it. Wink

Welcome to the forum.

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

When I first started, I borrowed a Maverick with one knee lever. Within 2 weeks I had read about the E to F change, and understood its function, and was frustrated that the Maverick didn't have it.

Much of today's instruction material includes things that use E to F raise at the very least. And in the opinion of most players, myself included, the E to Eb change should be on both E strings, and the second string lower should be on a different knee lever.

There are different options for the 4th lever, and it's true that it's going to be a while before you will be exploring those, but as Brint says, you may as well get a guitar that already has one save yourself the trouble of adding it later.

BTW both the Carter Starter and the Stage One have 4 of them.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

On more thing- do you want to play rock? If so, you will do better with a 12 string. The extra strings will allow you to play power chords.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

I am thinking I am going to pull the trigger on the BMI S-12 and get it at 1400 bucks. Anyone have any opinion on these?

Mike Moffitt · From: South Carolina

My only advice to you is STAY AWAY FROM THE CARTER STARTER,,Now that I've made that clear,Welcome

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Chris Reesor · From: British Columbia, Canada

The BMI you speak of is probably in some sort of extended E9 tuning ( by the 4 floor/ 5 knee pedal count)and is a good, solid professional grade instrument. It will keep you busy for many years.

With luck, the seller will be able to show you the changes it's set up for,what gauge strings to use, and so on. A visit to Al Briscoe at Steel Guitars of Canada with your new baby would be a smart move; Al can quickly sort it out for you. You could get picks, bar, strings, etc. and steel recordings and instruction material there while you're at it.

Welcome to the Forum; it's an amazing place and I wish it had existed when I was a new steeler.

Cheers, Chris
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Excel Superb U12, MIJ Squier tele, modified Deluxe Reverb RI, Cube 80XL, self built acoustics & mandolins

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Chris Reesor · From: British Columbia, Canada

There you go, Sandro. If you buy from Al, you'll be sure to get a guitar that's ready to go, set up properly. Enjoy the journey!

CR.
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Excel Superb U12, MIJ Squier tele, modified Deluxe Reverb RI, Cube 80XL, self built acoustics & mandolins

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Tommy Boswell · From: Virginia, USA

Don't overlook MSA Classic, if you run across a used one. They are professional grade instruments, and usually priced below other used models for some reason, maybe because so many were made back in the 70s. My first guitar was a garage sale find, a 4x4 MSA Classic. I'm so glad I did not buy a Carter Starter!

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

The MSA Classic (and Semi Classic) have lower values both because of their quantity and their mass. My D-10 Classic weighs a LOT, probably beyond 70#.
That's 20 more than comparable guitars.
That said, they're solidly built, mechanically. And VERY easy to change copedent around on.
And they come in many attractive styles of Formica. (and the later ones did come in lacquer)
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Sandro Rocco · From: St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Thank you everyone for your input and welcoming to the community. I have decided to go with a BMI S-12. Extended E9 with 5 knee levers (lkl, lkv, lkr, rnl, rnr) and 4 floor pedals. I didn't think I would be getting something so advanced off the bat, but everyone has told me to jump in with both feet. So I think all of you again. I am picking up my pedal steel on Sunday. I am sure I will have a ton of question for everyone then.

Here's a first one: Any copedents I should be looking at for this specific build? I have been looking at b0b's page for it:

Is this what I should be expecting: http://www.b0b.com/tunings/mcclung.htm

and what is comp?

Thanks

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

On a copedent, that's short for compensators. Raising or lowering a small amount to "true" another interval.
One thing I'd recommend, unless you're already quite mechanically inclined, would be to have Al put your desired copedent on it.
Better yet, ask him what's on it, and if it has the same changes, but on different knees, save the money (he's not gonna spend a couple hours under your guitar for free, of course)

EDIT (after looking at John's copedent):
Most guitars will have John's X pedal on a lever, usually the vertical.
Like Mike P. said, most folks put at least the E#(most call it F, but it's not used as an F) lever on the LKL, and almost as many put their D# lever on the LKR.
His near LKL and his LKR are common changes, so common they're pretty standard.
I would expect those changes, but in different places. Most likely a mirror swap, LKL <-> RKR and LKR <-> RKL. And pedal X on the vertical. I can think of a couple different things for the 4th pedal, but it might be different.
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2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

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