Why the push pull sound ?

Bill Dobkins · From: Rolla Missouri, USA

Although I like the PP sound there are lots of tone's I like. I mean if everyone sounded like a PP wouldn't that get somewhat redundant. It's like having all 6 strings sound like a Les Paul. I've actually heard people say they didn't like some one's tone, when ask why they, said it just don't have that PP bell tone.. To each his own is what I say. What do you all think.
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Mark van Allen · From: Watkinsville, Ga. USA

Bill, while I do love the beautiful sound of a PP in the hands of a master player, I've heard SO many great tones and styles over the years in so many genres of music that I simply can't single out any one guitar as the pinnacle of great steel tone. Or any one player for that matter.
Reading so many PP related threads over the years I have often wondered how much of the "sound" that people refer to is inextricably bound up with the era and musical style that they first heard a PP in connection with.
While I understand that the inherent tone and response of a particular guitar can be truly inspiring, I think there's a good amount of mythologizing going on. There are a whole lot of well-built instruments out there that each have a wonderful voice of their own.

Bobby Hearn · From: Henrietta, Tx

Kinda what i'm thinking Mark.

Ransom Beers · Posted 18 Jan 2012 5:12 pm

Tone is in the ears of the beholder,the amp,& the player.

Dickie Whitley · Posted 18 Jan 2012 5:13 pm

I just always thought that since the PP was the best thing that came along at the time, everybody just came to believe that's the way everything should sound. I often wonder if the roles had been reversed and the all pull came out first if the PP would ever have had any success. I've just never believed the PP had the tone that all others should be judged by.

Roger Crawford · From: Griffin, GA USA

I've tried several times to get "my" tone from a P/P. I have never been able to do it. It's not the guitars, as I have heard other people play the same rig and sound great. I do have an all pull that I really like, and have have people tell me it has a P/P sound to it. Go figure.

Larry Bell · From: Englewood, Florida

All just my humble opinion. . .
It's a personal thing. Nobody hears tones the same as anyone else. Different players expect different response from their instruments. I'm a fan of push-pull guitars because mine is the best sounding and best playing guitar I have ever owned. I will keep it as long as I can play.

For the feel, I prefer a longer throw and even adjust my all pull guitars to longer, easier pulls -- especially on some changes -- like the A pedal on E9. I also like a guitar that I have to hold back on stage because it is so vibrant. Some need you to milk the last drop of tone and sustain from them. Not true of any of the push-pull guitars I've had and played.

Some guitars reproduce low mids well but get wimpy in the high mids and highs. A push-pull has very little low mid response with strong, clear high mids. When you compensate with the eq on an amp, adding highs and high mids to a guitar that's bass heavy results in a brittle high end. If you don't compensate it can get lost in the mix. It works much better (for me) to boost the lows and low mids with a guitar that delivers the string separation and high mid response I'm looking for. You maintain the clarity and control the balls on the bottom end. A push-pull is that type of guitar. There IS something different from an all pull in the high and low mids. And I like it.

Jerry Fessenden's guitar stands up well to the push-pull as does my ZumSteel I played for 20 years. There are a few brands out there with that liveliness that I usually find in a push-pull, but many don't give me what I'm looking for.

Whether you like a push-pull, as a player or as a listener, depends on what YOU are looking for.
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Richard Damron · From: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA (deceased)

"Personal Preference", folks. "Personal Preference" trumps any claim of "best" every time. Indubitably.

Richard

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

When I purchased my P/P in 1972, I didn't even know what a P/P was. Likewise, I'd never before heard of
cabinet drop, short/long scale, and all of the other technical stuff discussed here on the SGF. Why, I didn't even get stereo pickups.

I guess I was just uneducated......... Embarassed

I love the tone my Emmons produces and the trouble free system that has served me so very well.

Robert Cates · From: Maine, USA

I think that Larry has said it very well when he said that he likes a guitar that he has to hold back on stage because it is so vibrant. Some people who are very particular about there sound knows exactly what he is talking about. It has sparkle to it and wants to sing.
Others on this forum don't have a clue what he is talking about because they have not had the chance to play one or else they just don't care.

We all love to talk about our guitars because we all love them. There is a difference between guitars. Some people know the difference and some people don't. Strum your steel with no amp hooked up and then go strum a push pull.

Sorry for just flapping my gums but I must say one more thing. The G2 that I recently purchased has got it. Enough said.

Bob

Billy Knowles · From: Kenansville, N. C. 28349 usa

agree with Ray

Buck Grantham R.I.P. · From: Denham Springs, LA. USA

well guys , I played Emmons pushpulls for 26 years and loved the sound of them, however now I play a G2 Mullen (wood body, alum necks) Guitar and it sounds diffrent but great ,stays in tune , very little body drop and it stays adjusted as long as I keep fresh strings on it .I am very happy with it and I would not go back to a push-pull or any other kind of guitar.It is not often that any of us are satisfied with our guitars but I am completely happy with my G2. It sustains longer than any other guitar I ever had. It is absolutely the best guitar I ever owned. Smile

Buck Grantham
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Robert Cates · From: Maine, USA

Yea Mr Grantham

Go get em.
You are absolutely right when you talk about the sustain of these G2's. It sings beautifully and keeps on ringing with little effort by the player.
Before I got my G2 I was playing a Sho Bud LDG, so you can just imagine the difference between the two. Night and day.

Keep smiling

Bob

Bill Dobkins · From: Rolla Missouri, USA

Well I have to chime in about my Rittenberry. It has a tone of its own. I've also heard guys say the Ritt has the belltone of a PP. I heard Gary Rittenberry play through a Steelking without any effects except some verb and sounded exactly like a PP.My Ritt stays in tune, plays excellent and sculptured by a master builder, what more could you ask for. I get lots of compliments at show's about my sound so I guess its OK. As long as I like it that's what counts.
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Custom Rittenberry SD10
Boss Katana 100 Amp
Positive Grid Spark amp
BJS Bars
Z~Legend Pro,Custom Tele
Honor our Vet's.
Now pass the gravy.

Bryan Daste · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

I think it's all about what YOU want to hear coming out of YOUR amp. I bought a push/pull several years back because I heard another steel player (Bob Littleton) playing one straight into a Session 400, and it sounded so fantastic I said, "I need to be able to make that sound!" I love my Emmons p/p. But I also love my Sierra all pull that I keep at home to practice and do demo recordings on. And my Dekley travel guitar - they all have their own unique 'feel' and tone. I don't think there is any Holy Grail of tone - it's just what works for you as a player and makes you happy. If it's a stick with a piece of wire strung across it, go for it!

Buck Grantham R.I.P. · From: Denham Springs, LA. USA

It,s what each wants to hear that counts . I think that if we,re happy when we play our steels it will rub off on the people that we play to and they will love it too, at least I hope so. Buck Smile

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Randy Gilliam · From: San Antonio, Texas, USA

My take on the PP Tone Is On Stage Its The Best Thing I have Ever Heard! In The Crowd a Carter Showbud, Zum, Mullen, Or Whatever It Is Sounds Just as Good To Me! If You have a Good Player Makeing The Sound! Randy Gilliam. Very Happy

Robert Harper · From: Alabama, USA

I am a rookie, a nephyte, and a sit and home player. That being said, I went to a couple of shows and there is a difference, a large difference. If I had the money to pay what people want for one I would certainly buy one, thats how convinced I am.
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Robert Harper · From: Alabama, USA

I am a rookie, a nephyte, and a sit and home player. That being said, I went to a couple of shows and there is a difference, a large difference. If I had the money to pay what people want for one I would certainly buy one, thats how convinced I am.
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"Oh what a tangled web we weave when we first begin to deceive" Someone Famous

Robert Harper · From: Alabama, USA

I am a rookie, a nephyte, and a sit and home player. That being said, I went to a couple of shows and there is a difference, a large difference. If I had the money to pay what people want for one I would certainly buy one, thats how convinced I am.
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"Oh what a tangled web we weave when we first begin to deceive" Someone Famous

Scott Henderson · From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA

I agree with Bryan and Buck...The best tone is the tone you like and fits the song you're playing on....Jerry Newberry hates this, lol, but some times I run my double ten with both pickups on to get that PP tone....Just depends on what I am looking for at the time tonewise...Course I'm a tube freak also....(I admit it and I go to TA meetings...Tubeaholics Anonymous)
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Mike Archer · From: church hill tn

ive played emmons guitars for many years
and the pp has a great tone
BUT I hate the mechanics on PPs
give me an all pull anyday
my favorite emmons is the SKH legrande
my favorite STEEL is the Rittenberry
85% of tone comes from the hands
and thats a fact
Mike Very Happy

James Mayer · Posted 20 Jan 2012 10:00 am **Re: Push Pull Tone**

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

I played a cut-tail Emmons P/P for 10 yrs. For the first few yrs, I could hardly tell one from the other but I was new to steel guitar.

I foolishly sold it when I started playing Universals. It didn't take long for seller's remorse to set in. I've played many other guitars since then. One particular Mullen has incredible tone and response. So did the P/P.

That makes the difference. The way a guitar responds to your touch...how it gives you feedback....how it sounds and feels to you when you are playing it. You are playing for yourself as much or more than for anyone, anything else. Big powerful tone that that you almost have to try and contain.

It's almost a curse, so much that if you lose it, you will spend the rest of your playing days trying to recapture that experience. JMO.

As stated, only one other guitar has responded like the old Emmons I had. Great tone from both, but different from where I sit.

Robert Harper · From: Alabama, USA

Guys I havent seen a Emmons PP for 1K, on the forum. The Push Pulls I have seen the asking price is aroun 3K. I am not saying they aren't worth that, but for what I do it s difficult to justify that price
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