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Topic: 2X12 or 1X15? |
Cody Russell
From:
Arkansas, now in Denver
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Posted 10 Jun 2011 5:55 pm |
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There's a great thread currently about how to convert a twin to a 15" speaker. What I want to know is can a twin push a single 15 as good as the 2 12" that it was made for? Are there any mods that need to be done to push the 15 to it's fll potential.(specifically my 66) I just had Bill Webb work on my amp at Austin vintage and set it up for steel.(amazing difference in tone. Very happy with the new tone) he told me that the speakers in this amp were the wrong ohms and i need to get new ones. I got he amp for a good price so I'm willIng to do what it takes to make it sound like I want. Just trying to decide what speakers to put in there. Thanks
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carter pro, 66 twin revrerb, steel king, tut taylor dobro, gibson rb 250 |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 10 Jun 2011 6:58 pm
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| The Twin will be happy as long as it sees the total load impedance that it was intended to drive. |
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Cody Russell
From:
Arkansas, now in Denver
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Posted 10 Jun 2011 8:30 pm
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I am an admittedly clueless about that stuff Dave. Does that mean ohms? And if I need 2 8 ohm 12" speakers do I need a 16 ohm 15"? Also.. Any idea what it would cost to have my twin outfitted for 15? Just a rough estimate without cost of speaker? You know like 100$ or 300$? Thanks
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carter pro, 66 twin revrerb, steel king, tut taylor dobro, gibson rb 250 |
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 11 Jun 2011 1:12 am
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Twin wants to see 4 ohms. The 2 12's provide a 4 ohm load total.
You can only mod a pre silver face twin, since only the black face ones have a removable baffle. (maybe some early SF models did as well)
If you have a silver twin, and want to put a 15 in, it's probably easier to get an entire new cabinet from somewhere like mojotone or Mather and move the chassis and reverb pan over.
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Milkmansound.com |
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James Morehead
From:
Prague, Oklahoma, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 11 Jun 2011 10:46 am
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Cody, I believe what everyone here is trying to get said, is a twin reverb amp is designed for a 4 ohm load. That could be two 8 ohm speakers in parrallel, which = 4 ohms, or one speaker that IS 4 ohms, or four 16 ohm speakers in parrallel, which also = 4 ohms. The amp doesn't care, as long as it "sees" 4 ohms. It make zero difference to the amp, if they are 15" speakers , 12's or 10's, as long as they are wired for a 4 ohm load. I use a pair of 8 ohm 15" jbl's wire parrallel(to make 4 ohms) with my twin that I have in a head cab.
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"Good judgement comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgement"~old cowboy proverb.
shobud@windstream.net |
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 9:39 am
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| I have tried a variety of 2 x 12 and 1 x 15 speakers in my Twin. I would not bother investing money and time to build a 15" baffle. A pair of premium 12" 8 ohm speakers will give you the 4 ohm load your amp wants to see. (I happen to like the Weber NeoMag 12s - great JBL -like sound and they shave some pounds off your Twin's weight). You should be able to get by very nicely with a steel voiced '66 Twin with good quality 12" speakers. |
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Olli Haavisto
From:
Jarvenpaa,Finland
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 1:31 pm
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I agree with Tim, especially with a valuable vintage amp like yours. 2 12`s will give you better dispersion and I don`t think the bass response will be a problem with good modern speakers like the Webers Tim mentioned.
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Olli Haavisto
Finland |
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 2:00 pm
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I have a Twin with Weber 12's - its ok. They are not light. Remember there are two of them, compared to a single Neo 15" - so they weigh almost twice as much.
Also, Weber speakers have seriously declined in build quality. Its sad.
Something is happening with that company - they are slowly phasing out products.
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Milkmansound.com |
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Olli Haavisto
From:
Jarvenpaa,Finland
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 2:05 pm
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I think Tim W. was talking about the neodynium Webers which are light.
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Olli Haavisto
Finland |
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 2:22 pm
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yeah - mine are Neo's too.
2 of them are heavier than a single 15" neo. Its lighter than the stock speakers, but its not that light! Most of the weight of a twin are the transformers anyway.
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Milkmansound.com |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 13 Jun 2011 4:32 pm
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| Quote: |
| 2 12`s will give you better dispersion |
which is true only if the amp is set on its side with the speakers aligned vertically!
A vertical array provides a wide phase-coherent dispersion on a horizontal plane and vice versa. Multiple speakers of any size arrayed side-by-side in the same physical plane (i.e. a horizontal array) will give excellent dispersion on the vertical plane but a very narrow dispersion with plenty of comb-filtering (i.e. loss of tone quality) on the horizontal, which is how the listeners are seated in most venues.
Four speakers arrayed in the common "square" fashion (a la the Super Reverb) create an even more powerful beam straight ahead but the vertical AND horizontal dispersion is diminished and replete with comb-filtering.
A single speaker, on the other hand, produces an equal dispersion pattern in both the vertical and horizontal planes, and being a point source creates no comb-filtering whatsoever. The resulting dispersion pattern is dependent on the size and depth of the speaker cone and the size and shape of the baffle.
This is why one should never point one's amp - particularly one with multiple speakers - directly at the sound mixer if one wants to be put into the PA mix properly. On-axis the amp will be so loud that the sound tech will usually leave it out of the mix altogether, even though a few steps to either side of them nobody can hear it at all. |
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Cody Russell
From:
Arkansas, now in Denver
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Posted 14 Jun 2011 5:26 am
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Thanks for the info guys. Does anyone have anything to say about tone tubbies for steel. I read a thread somewhere that bob swears by them. Anyone else tried them?
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carter pro, 66 twin revrerb, steel king, tut taylor dobro, gibson rb 250 |
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