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Topic: Physical demands of pedal steel?? |
Bill Miller
From:
Gaspe, Quebec, Canada
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Posted 17 Apr 2011 4:28 am |
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I'd be interested to hear what other steelers have found to be the most difficult physical challenges posed by the instrument. I continue to struggle with half pedaling the 'A' pedal. After an awful lot of practice I've gotten much better at it, but to hit it accurately on the fly is still a challenge...and a little hit or miss.
Another thing that continues to dog me is the technique of backsliding runs requiring a quick stop at each fret. ( ie. with the bar on the 12th fret pick the 5th string and sound 4 quickly descending notes backsliding to fret 9) I find that very hard to master...accurately. For whatever reason it's much easier to do it sliding up the neck. Sliding backwards seems to play hell with my accuracy and it isn't a visual thing for me, it's a muscular challenge.
Can you relate to these issues? Or what are some of the physical demands you've had trouble with? I'm not addressing this just to newer players since everything about the instrument poses a major challenge to a newbie. But if you've been at it for years, as I have, what still gives you trouble? |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 17 Apr 2011 11:45 am
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Half-pedalling my RKR without messing up with the volume-pedal!
I keep alternating between having it lower the 2nd string just the half-step or all the way down to C# - the feel-stop made the KL too heavy so I took it off thinking that I'd manage to learn that elusive 'half pedal'...
Not much luck so far!
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, Quilter TT-12 & TT-15, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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steve takacs
From:
beijing, china via pittsburgh (deceased)
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Posted 17 Apr 2011 12:47 pm Moving Steel
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| Carrying the instrument in its case. Not joking here. I've resorted to wheels, but there are times when it needs to be lifted. Oh yeah, I've had two hernias repaired. stevet t |
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Dan Beller-McKenna
From:
Durham, New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 17 Apr 2011 1:30 pm
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Hammer-ons and pull-offs on the tenth string without putting a bar ding in the rear apron. (Roger's RKR/VP issue is a close second, though.)
Dan |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Bill Miller
From:
Gaspe, Quebec, Canada
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 5:57 am
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| How about really wide grips (eg. 3,5 & 10 ) or oddly shaped grips? I've been fooling with more wide grips after seeing David Hartley incorporate so much of that in his style. It takes some getting used to also. |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 6:08 am
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Not for me - 'grips' just need to be learned so they're second-nature, but that's true for any technique that needs to be acquired.
I've just wound off that 2nd string tuner again so that my RKR only drops a half-step - getting the C# with that 'knee' was fun for a while, but I really want that '4th' with pedals down, so it's been reinstated!
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, Quilter TT-12 & TT-15, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Larry Bell
From:
Englewood, Florida
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 7:27 am
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IMHO, all this stuff needs to be learned so it's second nature. If a player aspires to create music on the bandstand, thinking 'is my bar in the right spot?' or 'what do I do next?' interferes with the flow of the music.
Half-pedaling a pedal or lever is also muscle memory. If you can't do it at home 50 times in a row accurately it probably isn't going to fly on the bandstand.
Jimbeaux, you just need to take a lesson or two from Frank Rogers. 
(seriously, tho, I think that's just muscle memory as well -- also known as JUST DOING IT UNTIL IT JUST HAPPENS)
_________________
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
My CD's: 'I've Got Friends in COLD Places' - 'Pedal Steel Guitar'
2021 Rittenberry S/D-12 8x7, 1976 Emmons S/D-12 7x6, 1969 Emmons S/D-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Quilter ToneBlock 202 TT-12 |
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Rick Winfield
From:
Pickin' beneath the Palmettos
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 8:35 am grips
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Some of those 4 pick C6 grips can be a little tricky for me. i.e. str 3,5,6,8 w /ped 6, (for an Ab9 voicing)
but as Larry stated, it's all muscle memory
practice practice practice
Rick |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 9:03 am
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Is there a difference between 'learned until they're second-nature' or 'muscle memory'?
...just saying'.....
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, Quilter TT-12 & TT-15, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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Dave Hopping
From:
Aurora, Colorado
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 9:10 am
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| Roger Rettig wrote: |
Is there a difference between 'learned until they're second-nature' or 'muscle memory'?
...just saying'..... |
You say "po-TAH-to",I say "po-TAY-to"...Either way,if muscle memory is second nature,then it's less filling AND tastes great. 
Last edited by Dave Hopping on 18 Apr 2011 9:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 9:11 am
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As I age I find my back aches very badly by about 11:30 on a typical 9-1 gig... By 12:30 I am really in a lot of sharp back pain and just dying to get the gig over with.. This did not happen years ago... Its to the point where I don't want to play steel more than an hour or so. It was always a very natural position for me seated at my S-10 steels. Today, it is quite unnatural and causes some pretty severe pain...
Padded chairs with padded backs help some, but the pakka seat kills me. I am fine after sleeping a few hours, so its not causing any permanent damage as far as I can determine...
It may be because in the past 15 years I have played more lead guitar/singing duties than steel... I may get more used to the positioning if I keep doing steel only gigs... Not sure exactly what has happened, but its only the past few years this pain while playing has reared its hideous head... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 9:20 am
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I hear you, Bob. Lower back pain is a constant for me. I could never play steel using a seat without a back-rest of some sort. I don't play while leaning against the back-rest, but I need to have it there for when I relax (between stunningly improvised solos, for example!)
In the old days and before steel-seats were everywhere, using any seat that was to hand was normal, and I'd look around for a regular straight-backed kitchen-chair. I already knew to steer clear of piano-stools!
_________________
Roger Rettig: Emmons D10, Quilter TT-12 & TT-15, B-bender Teles and Martins - and, at last, a Gibson Super 400!
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 11:40 am
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| Back in the old days, club gigs in Cleveland were typically 8pm till 2 am! I could never handle that now. And those gigs were 5 or 6 nights a week. |
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Benjamin Wolfram
From:
Victoria, Australia
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 11:45 am
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| Carrying it definitely...and I've only got a single neck!!! |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 12:03 pm
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| John Billings wrote: |
| Back in the old days, club gigs in Cleveland were typically 8pm till 2 am! I could never handle that now. And those gigs were 5 or 6 nights a week. |
Yes... I did lots of 9-3 gigs in my days in NJ/NY honky tonks.. 6 sets, and never batted an eye.
Today, I would sign a "do nor resuscitate" order before hitting the A/B pedals on the first chord of the first tune...I would never be able to do anything like that again...
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 12:07 pm
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| Roger Rettig wrote: |
I hear you, Bob. Lower back pain is a constant for me. I could never play steel using a seat without a back-rest of some sort. I don't play while leaning against the back-rest, but I need to have it there for when I relax (between stunningly improvised solos, for example!)
In the old days and before steel-seats were everywhere, using any seat that was to hand was normal, and I'd look around for a regular straight-backed kitchen-chair. I already knew to steer clear of piano-stools! |
Roger... Yes I do the same thing... Don't use the back when playing, just between songs and MY stunning and stimulating improvs..It does help.
My seat has been relegated to a carry all... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Brint Hannay
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 12:09 pm
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Half pedaling is especially a challenge if you don't play the same steel all the time!
While I am pretty comfortable with half pedaling the A pedal, I have never found it possible to half pedal a knee lever without a feel stop. I always disliked "half stops"--a significant factor in the seven-lever copedent I decided on in 1984 and have used ever since was separating the 2nd string changes to eliminate the need for a half stop. But in recent years I bought a couple of steels with only four knee levers, and am reluctant to alter them, so I have worked on setting the half stop resistance on RKR such that I can feel it enough to reliably stop at D--with plenty of practice--while it still doesn't stiffen enough that I can't move smoothly from D# to C#, and now I don't mind the half stop at all. |
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Elton Smith
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 12:14 pm
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I use an office chair that is adjustable.With out armrest on it.I may readjust several time during a show for that very reason.
_________________
Gibson Les Paul
Reverend Avenger
Paul Reed Smith
Fender Telecaster
MSA S10 Classic
ShoBud
Old Peavy Amps |
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Robert Harper
From:
Alabama, USA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 7:09 pm Half Stops
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Thanks guys, I was begining to believe I was the only who hated half stops. I seldom box the guitar, way too heavy. I have a Pak A Seat, but I can't get acoustomed to the thing.
_________________
"Oh what a tangled web we weave when we first begin to deceive" Someone Famous |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 8:39 pm
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Oh, by the way, Frank Carter's Infinity Steel Guitars have a great half-stop on the A pedal! And it really works, either going down or coming back up, very accurately, with a strong feel-stop.
_________________
www.JimCohen.com
www.RonstadtRevue.com
www.BeatsWalkin.com |
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Tony Glassman
From:
The Great Northwest
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Posted 18 Apr 2011 9:20 pm
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| Jim Cohen wrote: |
| Playing C6 with 2 feet, without totally messing up my volume control is a big challenge for me. If anyone has any tips on it, I'm all ears! |
It's impossible for me too. Because I like to use the 5th 6th and 7th pedal changes together so often, I added a knee lever with a 5th string G-->F# b. That allows me to avoid 2 foot pedaling. |
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Greg Moody
From:
Branson Missouri, USA
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Posted 23 Apr 2011 1:22 pm
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| I havnt been playing near as long as alot of you guys but one thing I have noticed the most about the steel is you have to be relaxed to play well or at least I do.If I feel nervy I will sound that way.I also think if I am sick with a cold or just feel bad that effects the playing.In a nutshell I think you have to feel good to play good.Isnt it great that we have a place to share these things.I hope everyone has a wonderful Easter. |
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Elton Smith
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 23 Apr 2011 5:41 pm
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If im tired I find myself playing slower.If the whole band is tired we all play slower.I wear a thin soled tennis shoe to play in.I can feel the pedal better in the half peddal minor.Don't always hit it but I can feel it.
_________________
Gibson Les Paul
Reverend Avenger
Paul Reed Smith
Fender Telecaster
MSA S10 Classic
ShoBud
Old Peavy Amps |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 24 Apr 2011 9:01 am
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| Over the years I have played nearly every sort of instrument, strings, brass, woodwinds, keys, guitars, etc.. Whatever other challenges the PSG may present, the most notable feature IMHO is the propensity for psycological interference. |
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