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Topic: Any input on the Hot Rod Deville 410 or Blues Deville 410? |
Chris Johnson
From:
USA
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John Seitz
From:
New Jersey, USA
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Posted 7 Feb 2011 6:28 am |
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I owned a HR Deville 410 for about a year. Caveat: I used it for guitar, not steel.
Pros -- It sounds very good, the 4x10 move a lot of air and it has a nice open sound. It is very reasonably priced for the power and featurs.
Cons -- (1) It weighs a ton (2) It is very loud and needs to be played loud to get a great tone. (3) Did I say it weighed a ton 
If you want loud and don't mind the size or weight, it may work for you
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guitar player attempting to learn psg (God help me) www.johnseitz.com
www.soundcloud.com/johnseitz |
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Chris Johnson
From:
USA
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Posted 7 Feb 2011 2:40 pm
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Thanks for the info John,
Weight isn't an issue with me yet (and hopefully no time soon lol).
Any more input on these amps? Any pros and cons?
Thanks |
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Chuck Snider R.I.P.
From:
West Virginia, USA - Morgantown, WV
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Posted 8 Feb 2011 3:53 pm
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Chris, I have been using a HR Deville 4x10, which was a bit harsh for pedal steel. When I first tried it with the stock 4x10 speakers I thought it wasn't gonna work.
However, I removed the 4 10" speakers and installed a new baffle board and a JBL D130F 15" speaker, and that made all the difference. I have a lightweight Kappalite speaker I could have used to lighten it up, but I wanted to go with the JBL speaker, at least for a while. Aside from the the expense of the speaker, it was not expensive or difficult to install the new baffle board and 15" speaker.
Now with the 15" speaker I think it sounds great. I have had suggestions to gain some headroom by replacing a couple of the 12AX7 with 12AY7 tubes. But so far I'm quite happy as it is.
For me it was like discovering I had a new amp in the closet. Let me know if have any questions or want more info.
-Chuck
p.s. - Mine is not the reissue III, not sure how it is referred to other than HR Deville 4x10, and was made in the late 90's early 00's. Not sure what the differences may be. You might consider looking for one like mine used as they can be found for $500-$700 pretty often.
_________________
GFI U-12 Ultra Keyless, Carter Black U-12, both with Alumitones, and a sweet '70 Sho-Bud Permanent D-10, NV400 in Rick Johnson cabs, NV112, '73 Vibrosonic in Rick Johnson cabs, Hilton pedal, Steeler's Choice seat, Bessdang Gizmos from Dale Hansen, and a few other widgets and doodads.
I may not sound good, I just don't wanna sound bad. |
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 8 Feb 2011 4:21 pm
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I'd skip them and try to find an old Twin.
The new Fender amps are not *anything* like the 70's and earlier amps that we all gush about here on the forum. They are not hand wired, they are not tweaked for tone, and they are made with the least expensive possible parts.
As a tech, I suggest avoiding these new Fender amps at all costs - not just because they are annoying to work on - but because their design lends itself to self destruction. You may get lucky and get a decade out of it - but unlike its distant ancestors its not a very good investment. Its a montage of Chinese parts stamped together into a very strange sounding amp.
I bet you can find an old Silverface Twin for less - and after it has been gone over by a good tech, it will crush that thing in every possible way!
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Milkmansound.com |
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Chuck Snider R.I.P.
From:
West Virginia, USA - Morgantown, WV
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Posted 8 Feb 2011 7:02 pm
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Even with my previous post, Tim does have a very good point! I just happen to have had the HR DeVille 4x10, an extra 15" speaker, and decided to give it a try. In the end what you're realy wanting is the sound from an older Twin as he suggests. So, you may as well bite the bullet at this point and get one of those, then you don't have to churn through multiple amps before you finally cave in and get an older Twin, which as he says, can be fixed/repaired/rebuilt till the cows come home. They can be found for not much more than a used HR DeVille, and about the same as a new HR DeVille.
-Chuck
_________________
GFI U-12 Ultra Keyless, Carter Black U-12, both with Alumitones, and a sweet '70 Sho-Bud Permanent D-10, NV400 in Rick Johnson cabs, NV112, '73 Vibrosonic in Rick Johnson cabs, Hilton pedal, Steeler's Choice seat, Bessdang Gizmos from Dale Hansen, and a few other widgets and doodads.
I may not sound good, I just don't wanna sound bad. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 9 Feb 2011 2:13 am
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well I have a mid 90's HR Deville 2x12 and have used it for both steel and Guitar for a decade. I also have a 71 Twin. Both fine amps. Both different amps.
I would not subscribe to the above mentioned "build" comments pertaining to the HR Deville , this amp is rock solid and is just shy of becoming a bandstand icon. I would challenge the statement that Fender is using the cheapest parts that they can . If that was the case this amp would not be 15 years old and still performing great.
Let me put it this way, if I am not certain which amp to take to a gig, it's the HR Deville. The Steel tone from my Carter thru the Deville is reminiscent of the old Fender Steels, very bright with a nice smooth bottom end. Totally different than a PV. If I do sessions, this is the amp I use.
The Twin is loud ,clean and all that we know it should be, the HR Deville is clean and loud enough for a mid sized gig on Steel and totally kicks butt for the 6 string.
Do not walk from a Deville is my take...and I am talking with over a decade of using one.
t
PS, my Deville has the stock gold label Fender Emmi's... Also, I have maybe a dozen amps, mostly SF and BF Fenders and N400 PV. My friend asked me if I had to sell all of the amps except 1 which would I keep, answer..the HR Deville would stay. This includes a 71 Dual Showman Reverb and a 71 Twin, I would keep the Deville over those if the bottom fell out...
But just my take...and I am also a tech...yes the Devilles are designed totally different than the SF and BF amps, but that does not mean they are bad. Let the reputation stand, there are thousands of them out there and they are still considered premium. My new TV is also a PC board LCD design and I don't plan on buying an old tube TV anytime soon either...
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Tim Marcus
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 9 Feb 2011 8:43 am
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let me defend my points:
First off, even in the 60's Leo Fender was using the cheapest possible parts to make his amps. It just so happens that the cheap parts of yesterday are the boutique parts of today. Nothing has changed - yes, the Deville is made out of the cheapest possible parts: plastic tube sockets, circuit board construction, chinese made capacitors and resistors - a far cry from a 1970's Twin with the american parts.
As far as the TV point goes, its hardly a valid comparison. I used to be a TV repairman though, and I think your point actually reinforces mine, based on my experience repairing televisions. The TV's made today, out of the cheapest possible parts, are actually designed to wear out - the switch mode supply only works for about 3 years and then it pops. Its called planned obsolescence - the manufacturer wants to sell you a new set every 3 years.
Now, the TV's made in the 70's and earlier lasted for 30+ years! And you could fix them! I could probably keep an old RCA up and running forever. Same goes with the fender amps.
This gentleman is about to spend $1000 on an amp! Why not spend less money on something better that will last a lifetime?
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Milkmansound.com |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 9 Feb 2011 4:16 pm
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Used HR Devilles go for around $500, +/- Good used Twins , 68 thru 71 easily can grab $1000 or more, agreed...
Of course things have changed , this is 2011.
$ for $ , for a modern era amp, the HR Deville smokes the crowd. Note I said modern era amp.
My only point is that the HR Deville , regardless, is still a great amp. Mine is 15 years old and running strong with whatever parts they used, no different than any other Fender amp being made today. Even my Marshall JCM 900 has a PC bd in it and plastic jacks... but it is still a great amp...
Another common misconception, buying a 68 thru 71 Twin results in a great amp. Maybe...Maybe not. It still may need a tech to fix or bring it up to specs regardless how much one spends . It may not even have quality components in it anymore, buying vintage requires 1st hand knowledge of whats in front of you and an on the spot inspection. Paying over $1000 for a vintage amp can be dangerous without knowledge. Even after paying $1000 we may find we do not like those stock speakers,or whatever is in the amp,so add another $100 to $150 to get it to the sound YOU like.
Twins are great...no doubt...I'm a fan...
HR Deville's / Blues Deville's are also excellent amps and well respected even though they are modern era. I am the 2nd owner of my HR Deville...it 's been a fine amp...
By the way we are not arguing, no need to defend an opinion. I happen to like all of my amps, vintage or modern era.
Maybe the buyer in this thread doesn't want to mess with a vintage amp ? Maybe he just wants to read other opinions. Yes the amps have different guts, but I don't think they are as cheap as made out to be, they are consistent with the market for the decade we are in.
that's all I got...
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Chris Johnson
From:
USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2011 4:44 pm
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Thanks for your input guys,
Thanks for all of your points of view in helping me make this decision. Both the twin and devilles have their pros and cons. The twins are GREAT amps with a great sound (if they have been upkept and serviced regularly). But I can purchase a new fender amp with a great price through an endorsement. That's why I'm leaning more towards the new amp.
Question for Mr. Prior...
What makes the HR Deville stand out from the rest of your herd?
How does the Hot Rod's clean headroom compare to your Twin's?
Any more personal experiences are appreciated. |
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John Groover McDuffie
From:
LA California, USA
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Posted 9 Feb 2011 5:05 pm my $0.02
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| I have used both on gigs with rented backline. For some reason I prefer the sound of the Hot Rod Deville over that of the Blues Deville. I can't remember exactly why at this point. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 10 Feb 2011 1:40 am
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| Chris Johnson wrote: |
Question for Mr. Prior...
What makes the HR Deville stand out from the rest of your herd?
How does the Hot Rod's clean headroom compare to your Twin's?
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Chris,the Deville is a strong contender in my collection, quite frankly I have a few go to amps now and the Deville is one of them that can cut any gig..and I would not hesitate to drag it out. For about 10 years it was my only double duty amp . It is still the amp I use on the few sessions I do.
Clean compared to the Twin...interesting Q , the Deville has a good clean headroom range , actually I had been using a HR Deluxe ( 40 dog watts) which was really limited in headroom and thats why I moved up to the Deville. I guess I would say the Deville is right there , right at the cusp for head room for clean while the Twin can go all the way up the dial . Remember, the Deville is a 2x 6L6 amp and the Twin is a 4 x 6L6 amp...In DOG watts, 50 or 60 compared to 80 or 85 ..something along those lines...so naturally the Twin will yield more clean gain, which is what they are known for. What the Deville will give you is more bandstand flexibility for the 6 string given it has the dual overdrive thing...I happen to like the first position OD, I use it sparingly...so you can play at a lower volume and still get a warm drive, if you have an interest in that.
Now, I do agree that some of the components used in the modern era amps are not going to make it 40 years...and I don't mean caps and such because those components have a 10 or 15 year life anyway...the input jacks and such are not the stock Switchcraft style, they are PC bd mount. BUT the good news is there is an upgrade kit ( $30 or so ) out there for these amps to change those components to the old style. I have not done it, but maybe one day I will.
I can't speak for a new Blues or HR Deville and quality...but I wouldn't be afraid of them. I can only tell you that I have a 96 Deville and it's been a work horse...as is the 71 twin I have...as is the JCM 900....as is the Classic 30 !
Hope this helps, good luck
t
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders , Eastman Mandolin ,
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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