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Topic: telescoping legs slide down too easily |
James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 8 Oct 2010 8:13 pm |
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| I recently bought a used Carter S-10. I love the guitar, but the legs (adjustable) keep sliding down when I lean on it. It doesn't take very much to push the leg down. I've tried roughing up the inside, telescoping, piece, but nothing I do, including tightening the knurled locking nut with a piece of rubber, as tightly as I can, will keep the legs from sliding, too short. Does anyone have the same trouble, or, possibly have a good fix, for this annoying problem? -Jake- |
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Stan Schober
From:
Cahokia, Illinois, USA
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Posted 8 Oct 2010 8:33 pm
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Figure out the difference in length that you need.
Saw some pieces of dowel rod to that length.
Unscrew the clutch, disassemble the leg, and drop in the dowel, and reassemble.
They'll never drop again !
_________________
Emmons S-8 P/P,DeArmond 40. Slowly drifting back towards sanity. |
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Jerry Roller
From:
Van Buren, Arkansas USA
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Posted 8 Oct 2010 9:02 pm
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Sorry for the double post.
Last edited by Jerry Roller on 8 Oct 2010 9:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jerry Roller
From:
Van Buren, Arkansas USA
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Posted 8 Oct 2010 9:03 pm
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That is correct and if you happen to need just a tad more height, pennies fit really nice inside the large tube and they are "cheap", only one cent each.
Jerry |
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James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 8 Oct 2010 10:08 pm
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Thanks for the input, guys. I was hoping to keep my height adjustment, as a lot of the steel jams, I attend, have un-even floors. I know I could unscrew one leg, or the other, to compensate, but that seems so crude. I thought, perhaps there was some material I could put on the slider, to make it grab better, or, possibly, somebody has a device, like the collet on a router, that would grab better, so I could use my leg-length adjustment in a normal fashion. These legs use the same clutch system as a mike stand, so they weren't really designed for a PSG. I've been playing a Sierra, for years, so I didn't really notice the problem, till I got the Carter. -Jake-  |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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David Nugent
From:
Gum Spring, Va.
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 2:51 am
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| James....My solution for this problem was as follows: On an MSA I formerly owned, I first employed the dowel system that was previously mentioned as it is an easy fix and works very well. To allow minor height adjustments if needed, I purchased a set of taller rubber feet from Home Depot and when necessary, simply removed the foot from the leg that needed extending and inserted one or two washers to compensate for the uneven surface. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 3:58 am
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The "mic stand" legs have been used for years by just about all the Pedal Steel manufacturers; Sho-Bud, Emmons, Zum, Franklin, Carter, etc.
Are you tightening the clutch securely? The legs on my 29 year old Franklin do not slip. |
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Bill Moore
From:
Manchester, Michigan
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 4:09 am
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| I think the key words are "when I lean on it" Just my take, but I can't see any reason to be leaning on the guitar. Maybe you need to work on your posture, sit up straighter. Also, if your guitar is now tilted forward to fit you, consider, raising it with a lift kit. If it's level or tilted back slightly, it may reduce the tendency to lean on it. |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 7:46 am
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James, try taking the legs apart and cleaning the parts with some alcohol. It sounds like the clutch inside the leg has gotten some oil, or the like, on it. This will make it slip no matter how tight you adjust it.
You should never lube these clutches.
If that doesn't work, you may need new clutch parts. Several steel shops should be able to help you with those.
_________________
Best regards,
Mike |
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Jerry Roller
From:
Van Buren, Arkansas USA
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 8:02 am
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| James, are all 4 legs slipping? If you have two that will tighten up you might use them on the back. You can put dowels in all 4 legs and still adjust a back leg for leveling. If the guitar has been owned by one or more others it is possible that someone has messed with the clutches and got them assembled wrong such as turning the squeeze ferrel the wrong direction or parts may have been replaced with wrong ones. If the threads are not stripped the clutch should tighten. I would not expect it to hold your weight but should support any natural use such as resting elbows on the guitar with head in hands. |
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James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 11:22 am
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| Jack Stoner wrote: |
The "mic stand" legs have been used for years by just about all the Pedal Steel manufacturers; Sho-Bud, Emmons, Zum, Franklin, Carter, etc.
Are you tightening the clutch securely? The legs on my 29 year old Franklin do not slip. |
I'm tightening the knurled clutch nut with a rubber, jar opening device that gives your hand more traction, as tight as I can. I can still, easily, push the leg, right down, even after I roughed up the slider, a bit, with sandpaper. The clutch is assembled correctly. The slot in the clutch doesn't completely close, when I squeeze it over the slider, by hand, so either the squeeze ferrule isn't closing the clutch enough, or there is wax, or oil, making the surface way too slippery. It slides down, way way too easily. I'm not leaning on the steel very hard, and yes, all four legs slide too easily. I've fixed the pedal board, legs by cutting pieces of chrome tubing, and sliding them over the sliders, between the pedal board,and the knurled nut, but I want to retain the adjustment function on the rear legs. I'm going to try cleaning them, with alcohol, as suggested, before springing for new clutch parts, and I'm considering spraying the slider tubes with clear lacquer, for a more tacky surface, and a bit more tube diameter. Thanks everyone, for the input! -Jake- |
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Michael Haselman
From:
St. Paul
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 6:21 pm
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Never had that problem with my Mullen or Sho Bud and I adjust the back legs for virtually every stage I'm on. May need new legs or clutch, but David Nugent, I love that idea of the washers in the rubber tips. But, as I say, I've never had the problem.
_________________
Mullen RP D10, Peavey NV112, Hilton volume. Hound Dog reso. Piles of other stuff. |
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Ken Metcalf
From:
San Antonio Texas USA
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Posted 9 Oct 2010 6:57 pm
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I had this problem with a new Carter I bought two years ago.
You can put Dowels in the front legs...but not the rear as they need to adjust.
Carter had some legs that were not good.
I went back and John put new (different type) clutch guts in them and it made no difference.
You could barley touch it an they would collapse even in normal playing.
After some going back and forth I finally got him to replace the two back legs.
The deal is they had a bad batch of legs and it is not clear to me why they did not go back to the manufacturer and straiten it out.
Anyone that has used a mic stand or had a steel guitar knows, you snug up the adjustment and it holds period.
These were like if you cranked it down with a pipe wrench it would still slip.
It is a bit of a sore subject for me purchasing a new guitar and having to hassle over some thing this obvious.
I was in the Carter shop and saw both batches of legs, One type was good, the other one was useless and ended up in a dumpster.
In my experience the legs had to be replaced.
_________________
MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 10 Oct 2010 8:47 am
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I fixed it with a file:
 |
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James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 10 Oct 2010 7:40 pm
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| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
I fixed it with a file:
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Surely you jest!!   |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 10 Oct 2010 8:16 pm Telescoping legs dlide down to easy
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| The first thing I would do is clean the small part of the leg with something like Acetone.(Wal=Mart in the womens fingernail section, used to remove artificial nails) someone may have waxed the legs for looks or rust prevention. check the chucks and clean them well with acetone. Test first make sure it don't eat the plastic up. My MSA was the same way. I put wood dowels in all 4 legs. drilled dowel rods for bolts on Peddle bar. It only takes a little extention on 1 of the back legs to level the steel so it will set solid. a little rosin powder may help. Good luck and good steelin. |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 2:01 pm
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| James Jacoby wrote: |
| Earnest Bovine wrote: |
I fixed it with a file:
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Surely you jest!! |
No jest; it works great. |
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Gary Gittere
From:
Fort Worth, Texas, USA
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Posted 11 Oct 2010 2:02 pm Slipping Mic Stand Legs
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I had this problem with a MSA Maverick and simply installed hose clamps below the clutch (on the smaller part of the leg & it holds perfectly and is still adjustable. Can't be seen either.
_________________
Custom S-10 3+2; NV112; Fender Frontman 212; MSA Sidekick; Rickenbacker TR-25.
"Gary Guitar & My Famous Steel Gittere" |
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Paul Redmond
From:
Illinois, USA
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Posted 19 Oct 2010 6:31 pm
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The wood dowel method works 100% all the time. If you still encounter an uneven floor, get in the habit of carrying a couple of shims in your seat...the kind carpenters use for shimming door lambs and pre-hung windows in a house. Just slip one under the errant leg and slide it until the guitar doesn't rock any more. I use these a lot on outdoor gigs where the ground is rough, and I use pickle jar lids under each of the front legs to prevent the legs from digging into the sod when pedaling.
PRR |
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Ken Metcalf
From:
San Antonio Texas USA
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Posted 20 Oct 2010 2:57 am
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Wood dowels in the front legs maybe..
I like my back legs to adjust.
Or just let me know ahead that these adjustable legs are the non-adjustable type. 
_________________
MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes |
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Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Posted 20 Oct 2010 7:05 am
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At Jim Palenscar's suggestion, I installed some garden hose type tubing I bought at the hardware store. It was cheap, easy to install, non-destructive, and can be removed if necessary.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 20 Oct 2010 9:10 am
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I used thin-walled pipe from Home Depot to stop my front leg extenders from falling, due to my extended pedal rods. Different application, and basically same approach as Mike P. is using, but I prefer the thin pipe. That thin pipe has to have just a slightly larger inner diameter than the outer diameter of the leg extender. I just took out one of the leg extenders, brought it to hardware stores until I found something that fit correctly, and then bought some extra. Cut to size with a $10 pipe cutter. This should work and look fine on the back legs. Probably doesn't completely deal with your leg adjustability problem, but one could make a couple of short rings to act as spacers if you need to lengthen a leg or two to balance on an uneven floor.
I've used aquarium tubing in a pinch - I think mine took 5/8" Inner Diameter, but I can't remember for sure. Any flexible hose of the right Inner Diameter should do the trick. It works fine, but I prefer the thin-walled pipe. |
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James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 24 Oct 2010 8:54 pm
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| Dave Mudgett wrote: |
I used thin-walled pipe from Home Depot to stop my front leg extenders from falling, due to my extended pedal rods. Different application, and basically same approach as Mike P. is using, but I prefer the thin pipe. That thin pipe has to have just a slightly larger inner diameter than the outer diameter of the leg extender. I just took out one of the leg extenders, brought it to hardware stores until I found something that fit correctly, and then bought some extra. Cut to size with a $10 pipe cutter. This should work and look fine on the back legs. Probably doesn't completely deal with your leg adjustability problem, but one could make a couple of short rings to act as spacers if you need to lengthen a leg or two to balance on an uneven floor.
I've used aquarium tubing in a pinch - I think mine took 5/8" Inner Diameter, but I can't remember for sure. Any flexible hose of the right Inner Diameter should do the trick. It works fine, but I prefer the thin-walled pipe. |
Dave, your solution is the exact same way I fixed my front legs. Before I retired as a carpenter, I salvaged some chrome thin wall tubing that the plumbers had left in the job dumpster. It laid in a box in my garage for 15 or so years. When I was scrounging around in my garage, trying to find something that would fit over my sliders, I came upon the tubing I had saved, and found that it fit, just right, over the lower tubes! I cut it to length with, you guessed it, with a pipe cutter. A little polishing, and they looked like they had always been there! My fix for the adjustable legs, turned out to be skin prep towellettes, that the medical folks use to coat the skin before bandaging. It dries almost instantly, and leaves a semi-tacky invisable film that makes the clutches hold much better. I put some on my sliders, after I read some of the ideas, guys posted, and it's still holding, after a week or so. I play my PSG every day, an hour or so, every day. It's easy to get off, too. I'm going to carry several packets in my pack-a-seat, in case it wears off. I don't think, you can, exactly, chin yourself on your steel, and have it hold, but, so far, it seems to be working, for me. -Jake- |
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2010 5:46 am
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| Sounds as if the tubing used in the legs was slightly undersized, thus creating the "bad batch" of legs. The manufacturer probably got the tube from Sri Lanka or Borneo. I have stainless steel kitchen appliances that are covered in rust spots. Ya just can't tell where materials come from these days. I bought some 90 degree pipe elbows that weren't 90 degrees at all. They came from India. |
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