Use Telonics technology to relocate vp circuit?

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

I first posted this over on Sherman's rightmost pedal/vol pedal topic, but decided it probably should be on the electronics board so...

Here's something I've been wondering about...how about the Telonics remote sensor technology? Maybe the vol. control electronics could be housed in a small case that would clip to the leg of your guitar. You could eliminate the foot control altogether and get the big, bulky pedal out of the way. Particularly nice if you got a loaded up 10 pedal guitar. And you'd have both feet free to actuate pedals.

The sensor can be attached to any part of your body and activate the volume control by motion. As I understand it, it was designed for players with physical limitations. I don't see any reason it couldn't be made usable in this way. Dave? John?

The technology is already a reality. Read here: http://www.john-lemay.com/Telonics_Volume_Pedal.html

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

Which body part were you thinking of attaching it to? Shocked

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

...careful David.. Whoa!

Seriously, reading the info there, it appears it could go on an arm or a leg, hat or whatever appendage or part you could control motion of. I would defer to the company as to where's the best place so as to avoid inadvertent action.

Depending on the design and size of the sensor, there are probably several locations one could used it easily.

The sensor is already available from Telonics, I was thinking it might be nice to have the actual volume control housed in a clip on case so that one it would not be restricted to having it under foot at the pedal bar if so desired. Just a thought.

Paddy Long · From: Christchurch, New Zealand

Jerry, Dave had the remote sensor setup to attach to a ball cap at his booth in Dallas, I tried it out and it really worked just by tilting your head either forward or back - as you would operate the pedal with your foot. I am sure it could be activated in a number of other ways without too much trouble - very innovative thought process went into the development of that pedal.
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Dave Beaty · From: Mesa, Arizona, USA

Jerry, Paddy, you guys are right on the money. The technology is here. As a matter of fact, at one time I envisioned using the remote sensor technology either on a lever above the steel which could be operated by an elbow, or by adding another standard foot pedal which tilted a simple mechanism at the top of the pedal rod to which the sensor was attached (that pedal would be placed on the right side of the pedal bar for right-handed players). To date, most interest has been in moving the player’s head since (other than thinking.....) it has no direct mechanical function when playing the guitar.

It is interesting that when one is a bit older and encounters a bit of tremor with head movement -Voila! Instant vibrato...

I will try to insert some pictures of the present sensor. The actual circuitry within the housing shown is 'much' much smaller than the housing. It could be repackaged to be much smaller. Note also that the range of motion angle programmed into the present remote sensor can be changed to literally anything needed.

Keep up the imaginative thinking, the sky's the limit!
Dave

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

Thanks Dave. Forgive me if I'm not understanding how all the components of the system work.

I guess I was thinking about the actual pedal where you attach to the guitar cables as shown here might be reconfigured into a smaller unit to clip onto a steel guitar leg in order to move it out from under the guitar. http://www.john-lemay.com/Telonics_Volume_Pedal_files/new%20pedal%20foto.jpg Or is this component necessary when using the remote sensor?

If I understand correctly, there are 2 pieces of gear total when you use the remote sensor? The sensor and a device that connects to the guitar cables.

It would be nice to have infra red, rf or other wireless method of connecting the sensor as well so that the hard wired cable that goes from the sensor to the actual pedal could be eliminated.

I think what you guys are doing is great and this is a major breakthrough in the area of volume control technology and I am very interested in it.

Dave Beaty · From: Mesa, Arizona, USA

Yes, that's right Jerry. The main electronics are housed in what people normally call the "pedal". The miniature remote sensor automatically replaces a similar sensor in the moveable top part of the pedal when it is plugged in.
But, yes, you could miniaturize the electronics in the pedal, put them in a small "host" housing that attaches to a guitar, and then use the remote sensor like we have been talking about. As for wireless communication between the remote and the host unit, completely doable, just a matter of the cost and dealing with the batteries.
Dave

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

Thanks Dave Exclamation

Michael Brewer · From: Carrollton, Texas

Jerry,

I have designed a clip arrangement to mount the sensor on my glasses. I have a couple of crude models but I'm not ready to announce a finished product. The platform that the sensor sits on needs to be adjustable in order to fit each individual's physical proportions. This is the trickiest part, keeping the weight down.

Dave Beaty · From: Mesa, Arizona, USA

Michael and Jerry, I saw your posts and here are some things to brainstorm about.
I just saw the comment on a mount for your glasses Michael (congratulations by the way). I’ll bet you wear in eye loupe on your glasses when you do fine mechanical work, if so, it would be a similar thing. We “could” make it smaller and use finer wire if you need it to be.

We have finally completed and tested a design for the Telonics pedals which will allow them to be manufactured (as an option at time of final assembly), with an expression control voltage output which happens concurrent with volume control operation. When this option is invoked, the OUTPUT #2 jack no longer outputs the signal through the pedal as it used to, but rather, it puts out an expression control voltage suitable for controlling professional EFX units such as the Lexicon MPX-1, Fractal Axe or other units. When the remote sensor is not plugged in, the pedal operates normally using the normal INPUT, and OUT-1 jacks. The expression output is taken from the OUT-2 jack using a standard TRS cable, the expression control increases in step with pedal action; i.e., as the volume is increased, so too is the expression level from the OUT-2 jack.

Now if you plug in the TMRS remote sensor, the sensor now runs both the volume AND the expression output.

So here is the thought for the sake of discussion; if you were to set one of these pedals with the expression output down on the floor and use it ONLY for expression control with the remote sensor, you could control volume with one pedal,
and expression of an EFX unit using this second pedal by means of your eyeglass mount. The expression could be rotary speaker effect, vibrato, tremolo, etc. Now carrying this further, no one wants to use two pedals to do this, so one could repackage the electronics from a pedal in a smaller box and have a head-mounted EFX control system as a result.

As the pedal design sits now, with this new model, we are responding to requests to make the pedal control an EFX unit at the same time the player is controlling volume. This allows them to bring in vibrato, etc, automatically toward the end of pedal throw - on long sustains, etc.
But, just for discussion, the EFX function could be separated for control by the remote sensor exclusively.

Taking it a step further, is would be possible to build a pedal which separates the control functions within the same pedal – that is; volume control by the pedal tilt platform and EFX control by the external sensor, all in the same pedal housing. So far, no one has requested this and it would take a significant re-layout. But, it is possible.

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