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Topic: LKR lever causing 5th string B to go sharp |
Michael Hunter
From:
Traverse City, MI, USA
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Posted 9 Apr 2010 10:32 am |
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| I recently purchased a very nice Remington Sustainmaster SD-10 from a forum member. It's a great steel, but I am having one issue - using the LKR lever to lower the E strings to D# is resulting in my 5th string B to raise about a semitone. (Makes the B pedal + LKR combo sound pretty hairy!) The only changes currently set up on the the 5th string are the standard B and C pedal raises. I'd certainly appreciate any suggestions for how I could go about fixing this issue. Thanks! |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 9 Apr 2010 12:25 pm
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Michael, it sure sounds like you've got some unwanted friction between moving parts on the undercarriage. The solution might be as simple as a little lubrication in the right spot.
Turn the guitar over and slowly work the knee lever that lowers the E-strings. Look closely and trace all of the movement you see, making sure that no part of the pulling mechanism for the 4th and 8th string is rubbing against any other part that's connected to the 5th or 10th string.
If you don't see anyting, take a close look at the changer itself while working that knee lever in and out. You might see a friction point there that could use some lubrication. If all else fails, lube the top of the changer fingers. |
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Michael Hunter
From:
Traverse City, MI, USA
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Posted 9 Apr 2010 12:34 pm
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| Thanks, Tucker. Playing tonight, so I won't get a chance to look into it until later this weekend. Sounds like time for a trip to my local bike shop to restock on lubricant! |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 9 Apr 2010 6:20 pm
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While it sounds like for some reason a compensator has been added to the 5th string your statement that only the 2 standard changes (A/C vs. B/C?)are on the 5th string kind of blows that off. It is not uncommon for the reverse of cabinet drop to occur- ie. lowering a string causes some others to go slightly sharp however a semitone raise makes one think of some interference between the lower rod/finger and the raise rod/finger. It will be interesting to hear what the real story is.
Last edited by Jim Palenscar on 9 Apr 2010 9:57 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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richard burton
From:
Britain
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Posted 9 Apr 2010 8:49 pm
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| I wonder if it's a rod for split-tuning the fourth string, which has inadvertently been attached to the fifth raise (instead of the fourth raise) |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 10 Apr 2010 5:41 pm
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Michael, check this one as well:
With the guitar laying upside down, activate the LKR while at the same time keeping an eye on the changer fingers where the rods go thru. It could be that things are out of alignment so that the tuning nut for the 4th lower is catching on the raise finger of the 5th string. or the actual lip with the rod holes is catching.
_________________
BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/ |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 10 Apr 2010 7:41 pm
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| I was thinking that too, Bent, but it's a lower and it is affecting a raise- I don't know how that could happen? |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 10 Apr 2010 7:59 pm
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Jim, as the three-hole tab on the lowering arm gets activated, it passes by the raise arm of the next string. If things are out of line a wee bit, the tab can catch (in this case on string #5)
Or, if the tuning nut or spacer sticks out beyond the edge of the tab, the same thing can happen.
_________________
BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/ |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 10 Apr 2010 8:08 pm
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| In that the space between the last raise and the 1st lower hole is usually the greatest in the changer that would have to be a pretty obvious mal-alignment or way too large tuning nut~~especially in that it has to extend "catty-corner" in this case. |
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Michael Hunter
From:
Traverse City, MI, USA
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Posted 10 Apr 2010 8:09 pm
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| Well, I've flipped over the guitar, and as near as I can tell the unintentional B string raise is due to the fact that the rod for the 4th string lower crosses over the rod for the 5th string raise in an "X." In other words, when using the LKR lever the force applied to the 4th string rod seems to be pushing on the 5th string rod, causing the changer to raise the B to a C. Being new to the instrument, am I naive in thinking that it probably should have been rodded differently? Is it normal for the rods on these changes to pass over each other so that they make physical contact? |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 11 Apr 2010 6:28 am
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| Jim Palenscar wrote: |
| In that the space between the last raise and the 1st lower hole is usually the greatest in the changer that would have to be a pretty obvious mal-alignment or way too large tuning nut~~especially in that it has to extend "catty-corner" in this case. |
Something like that Jim. Or misalignment due to the fact it was built wrong in the first place.
Michael, yes see if you can reposition the offending rod. There shouldn't be any reason for rods having to cross each other. It is acceptable to bend the rod in an "S" shape in order to effect a straight pull...if you have to. But crossing over can make problems.
_________________
BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/ |
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Michael Hunter
From:
Traverse City, MI, USA
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Posted 11 Apr 2010 8:30 am
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Well, re-rodding the A pedal did help, but it also looks like the 5th string changer finger is occasionally getting pulled along by the 4th string rod. So it works correctly about half the time now!
With any luck, a little lubrication should clear up the remaining issue. Thanks to everyone who replied! |
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Michael Hunter
From:
Traverse City, MI, USA
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Posted 11 Apr 2010 1:32 pm
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| Bent Romnes wrote: |
Michael, check this one as well:
With the guitar laying upside down, activate the LKR while at the same time keeping an eye on the changer fingers where the rods go thru. It could be that things are out of alignment so that the tuning nut for the 4th lower is catching on the raise finger of the 5th string. or the actual lip with the rod holes is catching. |
Further investigation determined that it was actually this that was causing the problem (though I still feel better that the rods aren't crossing over each other any more). Good call! |
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Clete Ritta
From:
San Antonio, Texas
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Posted 11 Apr 2010 8:40 pm
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As far as I know, generally all the rods should be parallel.
Unless youre using one crank to two changes on different strings. It's unorthodox and not very common, but adds an extra change without an extra crank. I read that on Carter's site. Hope you find the culprit of the remainder of your tuning issue!
Clete |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 12 Apr 2010 9:21 am
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| Michael Hunter wrote: |
| Bent Romnes wrote: |
Michael, check this one as well:
With the guitar laying upside down, activate the LKR while at the same time keeping an eye on the changer fingers where the rods go thru. It could be that things are out of alignment so that the tuning nut for the 4th lower is catching on the raise finger of the 5th string. or the actual lip with the rod holes is catching. |
Further investigation determined that it was actually this that was causing the problem (though I still feel better that the rods aren't crossing over each other any more). Good call! |
Michael, glad you found the culprit and hope you got it fixed ok. It sounded familiar as this has happened to me.
_________________
BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/ |
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