So if you could choose..

Chris Dorch · From: Wisconsin, USA

I am in the market for a steel and have been nosing around for a bit, but I am interested in getting an opinion..

Which would you purchase if you had the choice..

Choice 1:

An older (70s to 80s) very reliable and in good condition 3x2 pro model from a very well respected steel builder to which replacement parts are available. But, you'd have to put money (several hundred bucks) into it to get it to be what you want (3x4, 3x5) at half the price of the second choice before upgrades.

Or choice 2:

A brand new, very well thought of 3x4 (or 3x5) intermediate model (still configurable) from a well respected steel builder.

I purposly did not put brands because it's not about the brand. It would technically be about the financial outlay and potential for recurrent maintenance (which definately varies between brands, old and new). Therefore, it's hypothetical...

Personally, I think I would consider purchasing new.

Thoughts?

Don Poland · From: Hanover, PA.

I have

Rick Contino · From: Brattleboro, Vermont

I can relate to your dilema. I started out playing on an ancient late 60's MSA extended E9 with 4 pedals and 1 knee lever. Until about 6 months ago it was all I knew. Then this winter I bought an inexpensive carter starter 3pedal, 4knee standard setup just to see what it was like to play a "regular" steel. It opened a lot up for me because of the knee levers and the smoother easier action. But within a couple of months of owning the carter it broke in a couple of places and is now sitting up in my attic awaiting repair and I'm back to playing on the old reliable MSA that never goes out of tune and never breaks. I've thrown two more knee levers on it and two more pedals so it's a 6 pedal 3 knee lever honky tonk machine.

In general I think having at least 4 knee levers is a really good way to be. But also think about durability and how well the instruments stay in tune if you plan on touring/playing out. A flimsy instrument might get all out of wack in your cold car on the way to the gig.

Ulric Utsi-Åhlin · From: Sweden

For the experienced PSG tinkerer,an older,high-end
instrument at a fair price is...far out...but the
player who doesn´t feel like doubling as a Pedal
Steel Guitar tech forthwith(for days or weeks on
end,perhaps)will be better off housebreaking a brand
new instrument,if possible...McUtsi

Stu Schulman · From: Ulster Park New Yawk (deceased)

Chris,If you have enough money get a new guitar built the way you want it.That's just my 2 cents worth. Very Happy

_________________
Steeltronics Z-pickup,Desert Rose S-10 4+5,Desert Rose Keyless S-10 3+5... Mullen G2 S-10 3+5,Telonics 206 pickups,Telonics volume pedal.,Blanton SD -10,Emmons GS_10...Zirctone bar,Bill Groner Bar...any amp that isn't broken.Steel Seat.Com seats...Licking paint chips off of Chinese Toys since 1952.

Bobby Burns · From: Tennessee, USA

Old guitars are cool. Steel guitars are cool old machines. Unless you like working on cool old machines, get one (old or new) that doesn't need anything. I'd get the old one even if it's in pieces, but I like challenging mechanical puzzles. I'd get the new one only if it had a sound, feel, style and personality that appealed to me.

Bobby Burns · From: Tennessee, USA

I can understand you not wanting to post brands. Folks have a way of being swayed by popularity and name recognition. But in the steel world, brand names can tell a lot about possible mechanical plusses and minuses. It would be hard to advise you to get a new carter starter at $900, instead of a 60's Emmons push-pull for $450, just because the Emmons is old and needs a few knee lever kits.

If we're deciding between a new Show Pro at $3000, or a thirty year old little buddy for $1500, well I hope you can see the difference! Shocked

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Some of those older guitars are great, some are not. If you know what you're doing you you can get a fine instruments. if you don't, you may get stuck with something that will disappoint you.

I say get yourself a Stage One or Carp-steel, and support these builders who are doing us all a service by making affordable, quality student guitars. Both of these are actually good enough to use on a gig. (I'm unfamiliar with the Simmons, but I've read that that too is an excellent student guitar.)
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin

Rich Peterson · From: Moorhead, MN

If you have been playing long enough to know just what you want in a new guitar, that's worth considering. But one of the old and reliable instruments would be my recommendation. You could get an old D-10 for less than a new S-10.

The main consideration for me would be that new steels are lighter.

Dick Sexton · From: Greenville, Ohio

I'd already have this one, if I wasn't steel poor!

Lots of reasons why? Parts, Support, Easily upgradable, Probably sell it for close to what you'd had in it.

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=177899

Shane Glover · From: Oklahoma, USA

Hi Chris

I was in exactly the same situation as you. I chose to buy a Carter Starter. Did not work out. Bought a Sho Bud Maverick Did not work out. Took the plunge & bought a New Carter s10. If I had it to do all over again. I would Save my money & buy the best NEW Pro guitar that I could afford.

I know it sucks to sit around & wait when all you want to do is play. But make a poor choice and all you will do is sit around tinkering & tuning a guitar that you are not experienced enough to work on. I spent half the money of my New Carter on 2 guitars that did not work out. Not to mention the 2 years wasted coming to that realization.

Hope this helps !
Shane
_________________
Buncha CRAP !! But someday Ima get me some good gear !!

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Now that Carter is out of business, I can say without fear of hurting anybody, that while I applauded the Carter Starter for being the first student guitar with 4 knee levers, I think it's flimsy, poorly made, and totally unsuitable for anything other than that which it was intended- a bedroom instrument to get people started.

(Please note that this is the Starter model only. Carter Pro guitars are fine instruments, and the only reason I don't play one myself is that John, may he rest in peace, told me he couldn't make one with a wrist lever.)

The Carpsteel and the Stage One are more expensive than the Carter Starter, but they much better guitars. (Apologies to Bob Simmons for not including your guitar in this post, but as I said, I've not seen one, and therefore can't comment on it.) They are more of intermediate level instruments suitable not just the woodshedding-in-the-bedroom stage, of development, but also through a couple of years of playing in bands and gigging around town.
_________________
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin

Paul Crawford · From: Orlando, Fl

I love the older guitars and believe that if you take care of them, they will out lives us. But consider that I spent about the same to recondition a working, still servicable P/P as I spent to buy it. Taken together, it was more than I'd spend on a new one, but I'm happy because I wanted a like new, vintage P/P.

Unless you're in love with a particular guitar that you intend to keep, I can't see how reconditioning an older instrument could be preferable to a beginning/intermediate player than purchasing a new one. Older instruments still have their quirks and compromises compared to modern designs. For experienced players or ones looking for a particular style or tone, the compromises are well worth the trouble and typically increased maintenance. For general use modern guitars are trouble free, reliable, and comparitively easy to work on freeing you to concentrate on playing, rather than maintainig the instrument.

Just my opinion, YMMV.

Charles Davidson · From: Phenix City Alabama, USA

I agree with Mike about the Starter,[THIS IS JUST MY OPINION] A couple of years ago I was thinking about getting one[because of the weight] to use on small gigs. Was playing a MSA D 10 Classic at the time.A friend that was a newbi bought a new one and asked me if I would set it up for him. That changed my mind in a hurry about buying one. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.
_________________
Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC !

richard burton · From: Britain

If you're a new player, get a modern steel, as you'll have enough to think about just learning how to play the darn thing, you certainly don't need to be messing about with inferior technology.

On the other hand, for all I know, you may be a mechanical genius, so an old steel would be no problem at all to get working properly

Ernest Cawby · From: Lake City, Florida, USA, R.I.P.

If weight is not a factor the old MSA's are the most bang for the buck. If you want light go for a Carter, or GFI. There are several Carters for sale. Just post in the wanted to buy for what you make up your mind you want. I am sure you will get an offers. The Shobud Pro 1's are great sounding guitars, just select the right one.

ernie

Mitch Ellis · From: Collins, Mississippi USA

[quote="Shane Glover"]Hi Chris
If I had it to do all over again. I would Save my money & buy the best NEW Pro guitar that I could afford.

I know it sucks to sit around & wait when all you want to do is play. But make a poor choice and all you will do is sit around tinkering & tuning a guitar that you are not experienced enough to work on.

That makes alot of sense. If you are not mechanically minded, I would suggest that you follow Shanes advice.
Mitch

Allan Jirik · From: Wichita Falls TX

I also just went through this. I checked craigslist, ebay and SGF for a good used single. I learned that good used steels are still pricy and here on SGF they seem to get snapped up almost as soon as they're posted.

I chose the Stage One. Got it yesterday and I love it. I don't have to look at others' bar dings, cracks, scratches around the tuning keys, etc. Also, I played before and I don't have the urge to try every copedent out there. This is what worked for me. Good luck with whatever direction you choose.

Jamie Stoner · From: Bowling Green, Kentucky

I think it comes right down to your preference. I'm the type of person that would rather work on my 69 super bee, but know at the end of the day it keeps appreciating in value. I look at my instruments the same way. I can't see buying something brand new that may or not ever appreciate in value. I can go buy a new vehicle, and have something that is worth a quarter of what I paid for it in four years...So like I said, what kind of person are you? Do you enjoy the quirks of something old, while having something that you can not only play but cherish the uniqeness of all while the value is growing or do you want to buy something new that should be maintenance free (to a point) but has no nostalgia to it. Everyone is different and that is why we have classic car clubs and why you see steel guitars from the 60s and 70s bring what they do.
_________________
Michael Douchette's Franklin; Sho~Bud Fingertip D12; Sho Bud S10 6139 Serial #2911;1973 Fender Twin Reverb Silverface; Fender Cyber Twin; VZ Custom Telecaster; Epi Les Paul Custom Silverburst; Epi DOT; Copley Acoustic; Copley Acoustic Bass; Hammond E311 Organ; 1941 Chickering Baby Grand Piano, formerly owned by John Prine; 1921 Chickering Baby Grand 100th Anniv Quarter Grand

Charles Davidson · From: Phenix City Alabama, USA

I KNOW sometimes money is a big thing to consider,but for someone just starting seems it would be better to buy an old dinged up pro guitar IF it is in good mechanical playing condition than a new student model.It's true someone like Mr. Emmons,Mr. Seymour etc,can take something like a Starter,Red Baron,Mavrick,and play the heck out of it, But they are NOT newbies. I used to hang out in a friends music store a lot,seen people come in with their 8 or 9 year old kid that REALLY wanted to learn to play guitar. They would buy the cheapest piece of junk with the strings a half inch above the neck and expect the kid to learn on it,same goes for a steel. [this is just my opinion] I always thought it was a little misleading for guitar makers to put their logos on their CHEAP student guitars.A lot of guys that want to learn have heard of Emmons,Carter,Sho-Bud,MSA,etc,and they think if they buy a Starter,Red Baron,Emmons student,or Mavrick,they may think just because it has that famous logo on it,that it is a REAL pro guitar. Then they waste time working on the damn thing trying to keep it working and in tune than learning to play it. Then they get disgusted and give up. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC
_________________
Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC !

Jerome Hawkes · From: Fayetteville, North Carolina, USA

assuming you are new to the steel - i would go with new or modern used for the many reasons listed - you MAY get lucky and find a 70's model without need to sink money into it - if you dig the vibe of old instruments.
let me say that with steels - i would include anything mid80's-up as modern and a great value.
if you're going to be playing modern top-40 country, then get as many pedals/knees as you can find/afford - i dont play that, so 3x4 is all i need.
_________________
'65 Sho-Bud D-10 Permanent • '54 Fender Dual-8 • Clinesmith T-8 • '38 Ric Bakelite • '92 Emmons D-10 Legrande II

Bobby Burns · From: Tennessee, USA

I agree big time with everything Bama Charlie says!

Well, everything he says in this thread anyway> Winking

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

I don't buy anything new except for underwear, food, and beer! But then, I like to fix stuff.

Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

After playing, studying and working on just about every guitar available since 71', I can honestly give my opinion here. What about the changer? Is it all pull or pull release? How much does it weight? Can I move it place to place without pulling a muscle? Does it stay in tune? Who plays one? These are just a few of the questions folks ask. My advice to anyone, regardless of age or talent is, if you can afford it buy a new guitar with the latest parts and other goodies, then get it. The best deal to come along in a long time is the new Carpsteels. Yes, I'm a dealer but I'd say this if I wasn't also. It's lightweight, stays in tune, comes with a nice case, comes in several colors and is very affordable. There's nothing flimsy or cheap on these guitars. There built by Gary Carpenter. Nuff said. Gary's very particular about detail, even on the Carpsteels.

Bill Moore · From: Manchester, Michigan

I think many new players sometimes feel like they should try to find a guitar that will be good enough to be the only guitar they will ever want to buy. But in real life, it doesn't always work that way. After some time, the "grass is always greener" syndrome kicks in, there is always another instrument that tempts you buy. I've owned a bunch of pedal steels, and own quite a few right now, that didn't stop me from acquiring another one a couple of weeks ago. Cost is important, but so is value, I would probably go with the good used instrument. If you're a beginner, an S-10 with 3x2 will keep you busy for a long time. When the time comes, there will always be more guitars to choose from. The important thing, though, is that the first guitar has to be in proper mechanical condition, if it plays well and stays in tune, you will do OK. So, I suggest buying used, and being very choosy about what you buy. Get if from someone that you know can be trusted, and that will help you out if there is a problem. Later, after you get some experience, you might want to take a chance on an unseen guitar. Smile

Bill
_________________
Bill Moore...
my steel guitar web page

Forum Index > Pedal Steel	Goto page 1, 2 Next	Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic