Pro 111 prices

Jack Musgrave · From: Springfield, Missouri, USA

what would be an average price for a D-10 pro 111 that plays good but needs to be gone through and reconditioned. case is o.k. needs refinished to be really nice. lacquer has lots of weather cracks. the guitar belongs to a friend

Ricky Davis · From: Bertram, Texas USA

A full recondition of exsisting parts; without refinish; but recondition of finish....probably run ya in the 5-700.00 range...
A update of all parts and changer and refinish of body...will run up over a grand.
So if you got into this steel for around 800.00; and do the first senario....that would put the worth around 1500.00-ish....and that's about right....and the second senario; would put if over 2 grand worth..and that is what those go for.
So 800.00 to a grand...should be about right.
Ricky
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Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com

Don Van Wagenen · From: Washington, USA

Ricky Davis · From: Bertram, Texas USA

Hey Don; I do work on Sho-bud's.....but right now I'm swamped until mid summer(or more)...I can't look at another Bud til then.
The updated parts are made by John Coop....so you would need to get with him on making parts...>the refinish of the body would be subed out.
But the main thing is getting the parts made by Coop who is completely swamped also.....but you can always get in line.
Coop's email is > Cshobud1@att.net
Ricky
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chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

i can't imagine there are many people who 'wouldn't' buy an $800 pro lll that plays well. how many have you seen, ricky?

Andy Hinton · From: Louisiana, USA * R.I.P.

I'm with you Chris; I'll take 2 or 3 at that price & drive a few hundred miles to pick 'em up. Very Happy

Andy H.

Ricky Davis · From: Bertram, Texas USA

Ok I've re-read the explaination...and you're right Chris....I guess I had it mixed up with a trashed one someone was askin' about.
Yes; a good playable Pro III....should be in the 12-1500.00 range.
ricky
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Tom Quinn · Posted 21 May 2009 3:42 pm

Wow! My Pro II (ex-Lucker) sold from you at 2700 bucks in 15 minutes. It was clean but not restored.

Is there something wrong with a III? :- )
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I need an Emmons!

Ricky Davis · From: Bertram, Texas USA

Yes, I DO NOT like the Pro III; almost as much as the Crossover.
Mainly because of the mounting of the changer. I like the Axle running through a tail piece...and the Pro III and Crossover; both had it's own mounting to the body of the guitar. I find the tone to be inferior to all Shobud's that have fingers on a axle that runs through a tail piece.
So; this is my opinion of the worth of the guitar....Not particularly what someone would pay for one...>When someone asks what the worth of something is; it will be highly suggestive according to the opinion of that person making that suggestion.
Oh and I have worked on probably 10 Pro III's and just did not care for any of them.....especially when I have like that Pro II that Tom is speaking of in the house....>blows any Pro III away in a new york minute.
Ricky
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Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com

Tom Quinn · Posted 21 May 2009 3:55 pm

Thanks! I always thought a Pro III was a II only with aluminum necks. Shows how much I know... -L-
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I need an Emmons!

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

I agree about the sound of a Pro III. Probably the least my favoraite Sho-Buds for sound for the very reasons that Ricky described. Give me a round front.

James Morehead · From: Prague, Oklahoma, USA - R.I.P.

If Ricky said it, you can take it to the bank.

Herb Steiner · From: Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064

Again, I agree with my man Ricky Davis.

I bought a new Pro III in 1976, because Lucky Oceans had one. After I got it, Lucky asked why I did it, and then commented (paraphrasing him) "I don't like mine. Doesn't have the Sho-Bud sound. I guess I should have told you."

Mine was red... his was black. Even a black one didn't sound good.

My first 'Bud, which I got in '68, was a Crossover. A loser, but what did I know? Then I got a wonderful Professional in '71... a great guitar. Then the Pro III in '76. Another loser. Went back to the Professional until 1982, when I finally acknowledged the divinity of the Emmons PP. I've remained in that congregation since that time, though I do have a 1970 Professional I got a few years back that is a wonderful guitar and quite reminiscent of my original red Professional. I've been playing that guitar quite frequently lately, in fact.

Tom, Pro III's had 4 levers as standard, Pro II's had two. Shoulda gotten the II, then sent it up to 'Bud for a coupla levers. But hell, that was 34 years ago!

In another unrelated Sho-Bud development, about a month ago Stuart Schulman and I attended a reunion of BW Stevenson band members, at which Danny Hawk was present. Stuart asked Danny about the 1973 Lloyd Green that he sold Danny, who admitted he'd lost it in a pawn shop in the mid-80's. Little did they know at the time I'd found the guitar... in totally trashed condition... and with money and labor restored it to excellent vintage condition. It's now once again in the loving hands of Danny Hawk, my closest friend and where it belongs. Danny falls in love with the guitar every time he plays it, and I must admit, it has an incredible sound, superior even to my red Professional.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.

Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

Herb Steiner · From: Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064

Brint

I don't believe Ricky was discussing a "principle," as much as he was stating his opinion, though it's one I happen to agree with concerning Sho~Bud Pro IIIs. There are guys who do like the sound of their Pro III guitars.

Comparing the sound and changer mounting characteristics of a round-front Sho-Bud to an Emmons PP is totally non-analogous. Changer construction, from metals used to design is totally different. The Sho-Bud is an all pull guitar, the wraparound and cut-tail Emmonses are push pull guitars. Large pegheads v. small pegheads. Grover tuners v. Kluson tuners. 3/4" body planks v. 1/2" body planks. And have we even discussed pickups? The list goes on and on. The entire construction of the two instruments is so totally different that there's really no comparison at all.

The Emmons v. Sho-Bud analogy is similar to saying that, since an apple is delicious and grows on trees, a potato could not be delicious since it grows in the ground.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.

Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

Herb, I was playing devil's advocate.

With all respect, I don't see that your reply addresses my "point", such as it was.

Ricky said that in a comparison between a Pro III and another Sho-Bud which is very similar in every other respect, such as, say, a contemporary Pro II, the Pro III has inferior tone because its changer has its own separate mount to the body.

As far as I know, the various models of P/Ps are, likewise, very similar to each other in most if not all respects except for the manner of changer mounting. And wraparound and cut-tail changers appear to have their own separate mounting to the body (where bolt-ons are at least, well, bolted on to a larger mass of metal--the neck).

So differences between Sho-Buds and Emmonses are beside the point. If we accept the theory that, all other things being equal within a given brand (Sho-Bud), separate mounting of the changer to the body causes inferior tone, why would that same principle not apply, all other things being equal, within another brand?

Herb Steiner · From: Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064

Brint
Okay, I see your point. In my experience with Emmons guitars, which is more extensive than my experience with Sho-Buds, is that there is a difference in tone between guitars with different mounting schemes, but not to the extent that exists in the Sho-Bud.

My personal favorite sound in Emmons PP is the one that two of the four wraparounds I've owned had. The other two I sold to pickers who are more than ecstatic with them. Another great sounding... possibly the best sounding... guitar I've owned was Emmons #1164008W, which is a woodneck (bolt-on), but had other anomalies associated with very early Emmonses that made it not an appropriate stage guitar for me.

I've owned metal neck bolt-ons that sounded great, but one... a '67 with what Mike Cass believes was a mahogany plank body... that was so loud and brashy I couldn't handle it. My current stage guitar is a cut-tail from 1982, and I enjoy it very much, though it doesn't have the light sweetness of my wraparounds. It's a darker sounding guitar. It has other things going for it, however, and I like it onstage just fine.

My opinion about Emmonses is that while the changer mounting systems have differing tonalities, the basic design of the PP changer is the constant that makes the instrument sing my personal song. There is no specific vintage or model of PP guitar that I can say is a "loser." I've really liked individuals from each of the design groups.

Since I've only owned two LeGrandes, and those were for resale and not my personal guitars, I can't honestly comment on them, other than to say that I haven't heard a LeGrande that really rang my bell.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.

Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?

Ricky Davis · From: Bertram, Texas USA

And I have to go along with COMPLETELY Everything my brother Herb has said/commented on.
Herb that is truly a remarkable story about Danny; and warms my heart that LDG re-found its player. It's "All in the Family" man.....awesome.
Ricky
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Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com

Lavon Chappell · From: The Heart of Dixie

So you guys think that the pro II is the best sounding of the buds??

James Morehead · From: Prague, Oklahoma, USA - R.I.P.

James Morehead · From: Prague, Oklahoma, USA - R.I.P.

Basically, If it has an undercarrage that looks kinda like this, your getting into the Shobuds I get excited about the most:

OR a changer housing / changer that looks like this:

These are pics of a very very sweet first year issue ('73)LDG.

Basically, the early roundfront guitars with this type of changer housing tend to really deliver that shobud sweetness.

Fingertips and permanents? they are normally square fronts, and a different changer system than above, and VERY sought after. These older guitars tend to have tremendous tone--think Buddy Charelton with Earnest Tubb, that era.

Herb Steiner · From: Briarcliff TX 78669, pop. 2,064

Here's the guitar Danny Hawk now plays, first up top...

next, down below...

I put a good deal of restorative work into this guitar, but the outcome was well worth it. Not only because I took an abused guitar and brought it back to great condition, thereby adding value to the community, but also because my friend calls me every day to thank me for giving him another shot at this wonderful horn.
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.

Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?

Leslie Ehrlich · From: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

Ken Byng · From: Southampton, England

As Herb S said - there are those who like the tone of their Pro 111 guitars.

I have both Pro 111 and Pro 11 guitars, and have also owned a LDG. My Pro 111 has been the mainstay guitar for me for the past 32 years. I have played dozens of ShoBuds over the years, and I still use my Pro 111 with True Tones to bench mark them all. The tone to my ears (what do I know? Crying or Very sad

) is consistent right across the strings and up and down the neck. The sustain is excellent. I have played some Pro 1's, 11's, LDG's and Super Pro's that did not sound anywhere near as good as my Pro 111, and one Super Pro that definitely sounded better.

My Pro 11 has a fractionally less bright tone than my Pro 111, but both sound very similar when I play them. I definitely don't see the Pro 111 as the dud of the range. I'd happily get another one tomorrow if mine went up in a house fire - heaven forbid.

I think that a good Emmons push pull blows any other guitar out of the water tone-wise, and reluctantly that comes from someone who just loves ShoBuds.
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Show Pro D10 - amber (8+6), MSA D10 Legend XL Signature - redburst (9+6), Sho-Bud Pro 111 Custom (8+6), Emmons black Push-Pull D10 (8+5), Zum D10 (8x8), Hudson pedal resonator. Telonics TCA-500, Webb 614-E,

James Morehead · From: Prague, Oklahoma, USA - R.I.P.

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