Steel guitar newbie needing advice...

John Saad · From: Alabama

I've never played a steel guitar of any kind before, but have always had interest in pedal steels. I know next to nothing about them, but have noodled around this web site in recent weeks trying learn more.

I've got a chance to buy a Sho Bud Maverick locally. The seller is asking $425. It's the later version with the wood grain covering. Included is a volume pedal, picks, bar, extra strings, HSC and I think he's got some beginner's books he could give me. I haven't seen it yet, but he is sending me pics tonight.

I know these are student models and assuming it's in good shape, it seems like a decent price... especially if I can get him to come down a little. I understand that the Mav has some limitations with the 3+1 setup, but for that price it seems like it would make a good starter PSG.

The pedal system is obviously something I'm not familiar with so can anybody give me advice on what I should be on the lookout for? I mean, are there any signs of problems within the parts I should be aware of? Are there any books or web site ya'll can recommend for maintenance?

Also, I understand that these are set up for E9 tuning. Is it possible to set it up for C9 easily? Or does this take changes in the system?

Thanks!

Ken Metcalf · From: San Antonio Texas USA

I would try to get a good used pro model or a stage one type guitar.
It will help the learning process to not be fighting with some thing that is hard to understand at first.
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Rich Gardner · From: Columbus, Ohio, USA

John, welcome to the world of steel guitar. I have played non pedal steel for 50 or so years. A couple of years ago I decided to explore the world of pedals. I bought a Sho Bud Maverick and became frustrated knowing that one day I will need to relearn the E9th set up of 3 pedals and four knee levers. I sold my Maverick on e bay and bought a Carter Starter. This was a year ago and I've had a blast with it. You might be able to find a used one on e bay or maybe even here on the forum. Good luck!

Calvin Walley · From: colorado city colorado, USA

my 1st steel was a maverick , i only kept it about 3 months
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Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!

Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

The Sho-Bud Maverick isn't designed for C6th. You would need some custom-made parts to get the C6th pedal changes out of it.

$425 isn't a bad price, but it's not great either.

The basic theory of the E9th is covered on my page: http://b0b.com/infoedu/e9theory.htm

The Maverick's single knee lever lowers the 2nd and 8th string. Those changes are normally on two separate levers (named D and E).
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Michael Haselman · From: St. Paul

My first was a Maverick...I kept it for about 3 weeks. Once into the Winnie Winston beginner's bible, you realize you can't do it with a Maverick.
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Mullen RP D10, Peavey NV112, Hilton volume. Hound Dog reso. Piles of other stuff.

Bart Reed · From: Clarksville,Tennessee

John, I am not too many steps ahead of you, I have only been playing about 6 months total. I have to agree with Ken M. - if you are at all serious about learning, I think it will be a very short time before you begin to want the features a pro model steel has to offer, particularly if you have any prior experience in music at all. If it doesn't pan out, a pro model will return more of your money should you decide to sell it. Happy hunting, and welcome to a very beautiful and addictive instrument!

John Saad · From: Alabama

Thanks guys... a lot of good advice. I think I'll probably pass on this Mav. Although he did send me some pics and it looks to be in great shape. It's very tempting because I have several songs that I've written that a PS would fit nicely in.

So what should I be on the look out for and how much should I expect to spend? I guess I'd be looking for something that I feel I can learn on, keep for a long time, and won't feel restricted. Sho Bud is the only brand I really recognize, but what else would be good to begin with? Aesthetically, I like Sho Bud, and I'm a complete sucker for older, vintage stuff.

I like Ken's suggestion of the Pro. Anything else?

Also, Bob, thanks for the link to the E9 theory.

Calvin Walley · From: colorado city colorado, USA

read this

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=158326
now a days you can get a good guitar for around $1000.00
_________________
proud parent of a sailor

Mullen SD-10 /nashville 400
gotta love a Mullen!!!

Guitars that i have owned in order are :
Mullen SD-10,Simmons SD-10,Mullen SD-10,Zum stage one,Carter starter,
Sho-Bud Mavrick

Jason Williams · From: Seattle, Washington

I'd save the vintage stuff for a later date John. As a recent convert to PSG, I can safely say you may have enough on your plate just trying to learn this fantastic beast. I opted for a 90's Fessenden and I love it, but between basic repairs and diligent practice I can safely say a newer one would have been easier on my nerves. It has made me appreciate the instruments character though... I say $1400 and up.

Clyde Mattocks · From: Kinston, North Carolina, USA

I agree about getting the most steel you can afford. However 425.00 for the Maverick is reasonable and if that is what you can afford, it
is not money wasted. Even if you outgrow it in a few months, it will hold that value. The three, six months or whatever you spend with it is better than
waiting that time to accumulate the funds. My opinion.
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Steve Hotra · From: Camas, Washington

Hi John
Welcome to the forum.
This is the best place for all things pedal steel.
I am a beginner as well, though a long time guitar/keyboard player. I echo the above advice.. save your money and buy a used pro model, or the Stage One.
I was able to buy a used Rittenberry SD 10, here in the PNW. After a few months of playing around, I got serious and found a PSG teacher. I recommend that you find out who the psg players are in your area. I bet you may be able to find a really nice guitar to learn on.
Steve
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Guitars: Rittenberry SD S-10, Gretsch Black Falcon. Effects: Wampler Paisley, Strymon Timeline, Sarno Earth Drive.
Fractal FM9
Amps: Mesa Express 5:25, Jazzkat Tomkat & Boss Katana head / various cabs.

John Saad · From: Alabama

That's another thing... as much as I'd love to jump into it right now, I'm in the middle of studying a bunch of Johnny Smith and Ted Greene jazz method. Clearly a PS will require all my attention and I really don't wont be juggling both at the same time. So it may be better to wait until I'm through with the jazz stuff and can devote a lot of time to PS. Hopefully by then I'll have some more money saved up and get something pretty nice.

Thanks guys! I'm looking forward to being a part of this forum. Smile

Brett Day · From: Pickens, SC

John, GFI makes a great beginner's steel. When I started playin' steel nine years ago, my first steel was a student model Emmons S-10. It's got the Emmons pedal setup and there are three pedals and one knee.

Brett

CrowBear Schmitt · From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France

Welcome to this Great Forum John
you'll get all advice you need on your journey from the good folks here
i, like many, started out on a Maverick
it got me started & i was glad when i moved on to something else
it's important to understand that present day psgs are quite reliable, in tune, of better manufacture that those beginner models from back then
todays student models offer 4 knee levers
that 3 better than the maverick, red baron & lil buddy
imo, best bang for the $ is :
http://www.stageonesteelguitars.com/

on the other hand, a good used pro model could also be a better way to go

before you get too itchy & blow the budget, get out & meet some steelers & perhaps go to some shops that carry steels
i'm sure, that''ll help you make the right choice

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Do not buy a Pedal Steel Guitar with only one knee lever!!!!!

It's like buying a regular 6 string guitar with only 3 frets. You need at least 3, preferably 4 or 5 knee levers.

It took the pioneers of our instrument many years to discover things that you will read about in 30 seconds, and once you do, if your guitar does not have the knee levers, it will not allow you to play what you've learned and frustrate you and hold back your progress.

What you want is an instrument that can do more than you, so that as you learn more, your guitar can accommodate your needs.

It is better to have stuff on your guitar that you don't need, than to need stuff on your guitar that you don't have.
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Bill Moore · From: Manchester, Michigan

If you are looking for "value" the question you need to ask is: Can I get most of my money back when I decide to move to a more professional guitar. The maverick at 425.00 would probably allow you to do that, but consider getting a used Carter starter for 500 to 550. You will have a better guitar for learning, and you should be able to get all, or most, of the cost back when you sell it. The poorest investment for a beginner is a new, pro model. They do depreciate, so if you decide playing pedal steel is not for you, you will take a loss. If you stay with it, more than likely, you will eventually want another guitar. Be very careful buying a older used pro model. Unless you know an experienced player that can check it out first. Most of them will need adjustments, that makes it even more challenging for a beginner. Good luck to you.

Ned McIntosh · From: New South Wales, Australia

The Maverick is a student pedal-steel whose day has come...and gone. Unless you are on a very, very limited budget, there are far better options these days because the modern E9th tuning has so much more to offer.

The Stage One, GFI student model, or Jackson Blackjack will get you started and are keepers. Carter Starters are also good, but the Stage One is getting very good reviews.

On the other hand, if you can go one step beyond student models, just look for a good second-hand S10 with 3 pedals (4 is even better if you want the Franklin Change) and 5 knee-levers. That's more or less the de facto standard for E9th these days.

The Maverick may be bordering on collectable these days, but it is well behind the modern "entry-level" steels.
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The steel guitar is a hard mistress. She will obsess you, bemuse and bewitch you. She will dash your hopes on what seems to be whim, only to tease you into renewing the relationship once more so she can do it to you all over again...and yet, if you somehow manage to touch her in that certain magic way, she will yield up a sound which has so much soul, raw emotion and heartfelt depth to it that she will pierce you to the very core of your being.

Jim Cohen · From: Philadelphia, PA

K.J. Tucker · From: Texas

John:
This is the place to gather information on Steel Guitars Pedal & Non-Pedal !
I found that the " Don't Understand " section explained a lot , for a lost soul as mine . I had a lap steel and kept hearing that 'it was a dying art ' that the pedal was the way to go . I play 'AT' the Pedal and with the lap so I am still learning the triads of picking I bought a 'Pro' Model D-10 8X8 and was asked 'If I had lost what little mind I had ?" And I will share my thoughts with you now ;
I bought the most guitar for the money I could afford @ the time . I was told that it was like 'killing a fly with a bulldozer ' My thoughts and these are just my thoughts , Buy the best you can afford and buy one guitar and why wait till your better and buy and sell again! And have to learn more stuff , if you start out with good even if it is used equipment your ahead of the learning curve , but that is just My opinion and it cost you nothing but you are welcome to glean what you need from it .
Later

Tuck
Cool

P.S. I do suggest that you buy a single neck though , to me the other neck just gets in the way for now . The E/9 is the neck farthest away from you and it is the one you play the most the C/6 is closest and it makes a very expensive arm rest ! Alien

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Ronnie Boettcher · From: Brunswick Ohio, USA

Way before computers, and sites like this, I had the chance of buying a Fender 400. Had no knowledge of a steel guitar. Some guy sold it to a music store I dealt with. I bought it for what it was sold for and took it home. Diddled around with it for about 4 months, and went to Nashville to look at steels. Found out you need knee levers, and bought me a LDG. (LLoyd Green talked me into his model, when we were doing a recording session). Still have it, since the 70's, and never bought another one. My thought is buy something with at least 3 pedals, and 4 knees. Save your time and worries about selling one that has very few resale customers. My 2 cents.
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Sho-Bud LDG, Martin D28, Ome trilogy 5 string banjo, Ibanez 4-string bass, dobro, fiddle, and a tubal cain. Life Member of AFM local 142

Rick Winfield · From: Pickin' beneath the Palmettos

Winnie Winston once said to "get the most expensive guitar you can afford, with a minimum of 10 strings, 3 pedals and 3 levers "
you won't regret that 6 months from now!!
Rick

Scott Hiestand · From: MA, U.S.A

John

I think what no one really disagrees on is "buy the best steel you can afford" (within reason of course).

Tony is right, you could spend months with a Maverick 3 + 1 and for $425.00 you really can't go wrong. In fact, "in theory", since learning pedal steel is a lifelong endeavor, you could spend years on it, perfecting slants, bar and picking techniques, etc. But is that a likely scenario? Is that what you will want to be doing 2 years, even a year from now? No.

That is why Mike says don't buy a guitar with one knee lever. You will, sooner or later (probably sooner), want at least 4. Whether you buy the Maverick at $450.00 or a used "professional grade" single neck at say $1100.00 - $1500.00 (and that's probably low end of ballpark), you will lose very little if any money if you decide to sell, assuming you don't trash the guitar. So it's either pay now, for say a 3 + 4, or upgrade later. As long as you don't buy new, either way is a pretty safe bet, financially speaking. Put another way, as long as you keep with it, you WILL upgrade from a Maverick at some point. But that doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad choice. If $500.00 or so is your limit, it is a very reasonable choice.

Jim Cohen · From: Philadelphia, PA

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