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Author Topic:  Need Picking Help
Bill Hanson


From:
New York, USA
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 4:57 am    
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I never used finger picks on my six strings and I am having a "middle finger problem". My learning process is showing improvement on the thumb and index finger, but my middle seems to have a mind of its own. I either strike the string above my target or I play the correct string twice as loud as the other two. Any pointers on remedying this would be appreciated.
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Rick Barnhart


From:
Arizona, USA
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 6:01 am    
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Bill, I used to wear my picks around the house, when I wasn't playing my guitar. Even in my car on the way somewhere, or while trying to use a laptop computer, (that's a trick) It kinda gets you used to having them on, I was amazed how quickly they became a part of my hands, not just an annoying extension.

Another thing, there are those that will disagree, but, I think once you install that Don Blood armrest on that little Zumsteel, it should be easier for you to get control of you hands, because you won't be worrying about holding your arms in the right possition.

I'll never be a great player, but I can find the right string at the right time, now.
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Ellis Miller

 

From:
Cortez, Colorado, USA
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 6:36 am    
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I have a couple of PSG player friends who took up five string banjo because the right hand technique on the 5 was very helpful to their steel playing.

You may not want to go that far, but you might want to pick up a book on 5 string to learn the various right hand rolls etc and adapt them to your steel.

There are a couple of good books: "Bluegrass Banjo" by Peter Wernick and, of course, the Earl Scruggs book, "Earl Scruggs and the Bluegrass Banjo"

I am not suggesting you become a banjo player, only that the right hand technique is excellent and may get you where you want to be on PSG.

OK, I am ready for the banjo sarcasm posts. Fire away Laughing
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Ellis Miller
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Nic du Toit


From:
Milnerton, Cape, South Africa
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 10:09 am    
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This sounds like incorrect right-hand technique.
Have you looked at some of Jeff Newman's courses where he shows and explain about the right hand posture and placement?
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Phil Halton


From:
Holyoke, Massachusetts, USA
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 12:36 pm    
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I would suggest disregarding entirely the banjo analogy--sorry Ellis. Aside from the fact that banjo players wear two finger picks and a thumb pick, there is virtually no other similarity to picking on the steel. Banjo pickers don't have to control the sustain of their instrument with the right hand as do steel players. As a result, no fleshy part of their right hand ever touches the strings. In fact, we brace our right hand over the strings using the ring and/or little fingers as a sort of "support post" against the banjo head. The palm is kept horizontal to, and approx two inches above the strings, and we pick with the tips of the picks.

In my somewhat limited experience with the steel(two years), and as Jeff Newman shows in the palm blocking method, you need to use the fleshy edge of your right hand to damp the strings and control string sustain. This means no support post, and a right hand that regularly contacts the strings with a palm kept at about 45 degrees to the strings, and picking with the side edges of the picks rather than the tips.

Additionally, the way we wear the picks differs from banjo to steel due to the mechanics of the hand positions for those two instruments. With banjo, you can get away with wearing the picks with the tips extremely close to the fingernail--almost as an extension of the nail. With steel, for the palm blocking method anyway, you need alot more pick blade extending out beyond the nail to avoid getting finger flesh and pick wraps hung up in the strings. It can feel very awkward wearing the picks way out on the tips of your fingers as Newman shows, but once you find a way to wear them so that they stay on well, but extend out as much as possible, you're on your way. Finally, neither do the banjo roll patterns carry over into steel picking very well. As a experienced banjo player who figured he could walk right into the steel because of the banjo background, all of this was my first rude awakening. Essentially, all it was worth was a familiarity with wearing picks, and some muscle tone that I wouldn't have had right off the bat in the right hand fingers.

I had a teacher at first, but he never told me any of this stuff. When I found Newman's "right-hand alpha" course, it was EXACTLY what I needed to know--a full hour of close up video and explanations, combined with practical picking exercises along with rhythm tracks dedicated entirely to getting a good right-hand technique.

So, in my opinion, and as Nic suggested, , you would do quite well to get Newman's "Right Hand Alpha" course from Jeffran.com.

Hope all that helps.
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Ellis Miller

 

From:
Cortez, Colorado, USA
Post  Posted 18 Mar 2009 2:03 pm     The Clarification
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Both Nic and Phil are absolutely correct in reccommending the Jeff Newman material and in pointing out that right hand technique is different between 5 string and PSG.

An operative statement in my post is that the right hand banjo technique would be "adapted" to PSG. The point I was trying to make is that some very good PSG players have studied the intricate right rolls etc of the 5 string and have "adapted" those movements and exercises to PSG and have gotten a great deal of benefit from it. (The two players I am thinking about have excellent right technique, some of which they attribute to their journey into the 5 string.) That adaptation would definitely be within the context of correct pick and hand positioning, blocking etc that is appropriate for the PSG per the Jeff Newman material.

Thank you, Nic and Phil for weighing in and I doubt that we disagree that much. The bottom line is that our friend, Bill, gets information that helps him along his journey. ---Whatever works.
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Ellis Miller
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Bo Legg


Post  Posted 19 Mar 2009 12:40 pm    
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I just want to let everyone know that I don't intend to say a word about Pick-Blocking here. Winking
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Bill Hanson


From:
New York, USA
Post  Posted 20 Mar 2009 6:56 am    
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Thanks to all who chipped in here. I put on the armrest from Don Blood - that was a tremendous help. I can't say enough about Don's work and his attitude. I also changed my hand position and ordered the Alpha course from Jeff Newman. Given all the steel items I have been purchasing, my budget precludes buying a banjo however. Thanks for the input gentlemen.
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Tommy Shown

 

From:
Denham Springs, La.
Post  Posted 21 Mar 2009 2:24 am    
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Ellis Miller wrote:
I have a couple of PSG player friends who took up five string banjo because the right hand technique on the 5 was very helpful to their steel playing.

You may not want to go that far, but you might want to pick up a book on 5 string to learn the various right hand rolls etc and adapt them to your steel.

There are a couple of good books: "Bluegrass Banjo" by Peter Wernick and, of course, the Earl Scruggs book, "Earl Scruggs and the Bluegrass Banjo"

I am not suggesting you become a banjo player, only that the right hand technique is excellent and may get you where you want to be on PSG.

OK, I am ready for the banjo sarcasm posts. Fire away Laughing

Hey watch out with the "B" word, bOb might be watching. You know how he feels about banjos. Laughing
Tommy Shown
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W. C. Edgar


From:
Iowa City Iowa, Madison CT, Nashville, Austin, Phoenix
Post  Posted 24 Mar 2009 8:03 am    
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I don't think today that there is a right or wrong technique. Sure Jeff use to teach a certain hand/arm/finger placement and then look at Crawfords approach to it, then look at how flat handed Jernigan plays and then about the time you think you have it figured out Paul comes along with the pick blocking technique and blows most of them out of the water for speed. I still say, it's whatever works for you in your particular situation that fits the style and tone of the music you are trying to get. Some peoples technique may seem unorthadox to some but it works for them so who are we to judge?

Below are some examples of how I play. I get a great tone and still play really flathanded. WC Edgar



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxuIIe74ePo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGu57QuFPTY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDKOHweo8Xo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5fHre-bAow

www.wcedgar.com
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Bill Hanson


From:
New York, USA
Post  Posted 24 Mar 2009 9:00 am    
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Wow, W.C., awesome videos ! I had to subscribe to your channel. Maybe in 25 years I'll be half that good...hmmmm, that'll make me 90. Your point is well taken. I'll stick with the Newman course for now because, as a beginner, I need an anchor in the water somewhere. When I started 6 string some 45 years ago I picked up some bad habits that were hard as hell to correct. I don't want to make that mistake this time around. Thanks for your input.
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Al Marcus


From:
Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)
Post  Posted 24 Mar 2009 11:09 am    
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WC-I saw and heard your video of "Crazy Arms". It was a perfect example of good old Classic Country E9th Picking. Nice Sho-bud....al.SmileSmile Cool
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