I Finally broke down and bought an almost new Carter D-10

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

As most of you know, I've played the same G.E.S. D-10 8+4, for approx forty plus years.

I finally decided to try out something new, in order to see if I can get accustomed to the different feel, as well as, all the many newer changes, etc. "Hey! A guy has to keep up to the Jones Boys ya know!"

I've sat behind and played many other brands, but never a Carter before. So, I felt I'd go with a Carter to try.

"I believe in all honesty, a lot of my decision, was due to Carter having such great information on their site, and not afraid to share it with folks." That means a whole lot to me."

I've never had to deal with things such as cabinet drop, nor any other detuning problems in my old one. So I have no idea whether or not I'll have any of that in this one.

I believe what's termed as cabinet drop, is not due to actual cabinet drop, as much as it may be, the finger axle shafts being too small in diameter and flexing. Just my opinion, since my G.E.S. has 9/16" hardened Steel, finger axles. As well as, nothing else other than the (one piece) finger itself. (in the finger department of the equasion, which could possibly bind or hang up, causing problems).

But then too, that is just my (personal) opinion. And, just one of many factors of why I "honestly" never had tuning problems, (strings not returning true) nor any detuning due to cabinet drop whatsoever.

All of the above was due to George's Simple and yet Unique Changer system, as well as his cabinets. Were they heavy? Definitely! Were they worth the price? Absolutely! It kept me playing the same steel for all those many years, after having sat behind and played many other brands.

I know folks are tired of my constant remarks of: "I've never had this or that problem" (whatever the case happened to be). And as such, I suppose most here feel, I'm either one of the most naive, about how a steel works, or I simply don't know what I'm talking about, nor understand the meaning of what they're saying. I can assure everyone that although I don't claim to be an expert in knowing all of the exact different pedal steels on the market, I definitely am an expert when it comes to knowing my own steel, inside and out.

George reinforced his cabinets, so well, and in such unique places as important, in order to keep them from any possible flex, even without using full end castings on many of his steels. Mine doesn't have end castings at all. Simply corner castings only. And that was simply for the leg mounts, to screw the legs into. On others, he used full end castings. Plus, he used a full 3/4" Maple (mine is Birdseye) in his cabinets, as well as in his tops & necks.

George's changer system, known as a "Sell Changer" has never been duplicated, except for when Winnie Winston was going to build his first pedal steel guitar, that I'm aware of.. George gave him 12 fingers and a diagram of his changer system to use on it. Winnie made up the other parts he needed to go with those fingers. And it's the one pictured on the front of Winnie Winston and Bill Keith's book. "Pedal Steel Guitar."

For those who would finally want to take a look at that changer system, to show how it actually works, below is the URL to what was written up about it. I believe it was also in one edition of "Guitar Player Magazine" but I'm not certain.

George Sell Changer System Click Here

Note Added: The opposite end of the center return spring, (not shown in the picture) also had a small threaded rod, with one end flattened and drilled to accept the spring end. That threaded rod, went on through another piece of aluminum angle, (as did all the springs) with a small nut that screwed up against that angle, to adjust the exact amount of spring tension, that you wanted in order to return the finger (from a lower). It was therefore, why all of the pedals worked so easily. There were no other springs to have to overcome, on any of the knees and/or cross shafts, that had to do with returning anything. There were NO pedal stops. His changer system took care of all of that, as you can see.

As can be seen, that centering system, using the "Tooth" (reminds you of a tooth removed) was what we always called them, was ONLY needed on the fingers that were BOTH Raised and Lowered.. Other than that, a rod would simply Push the finger itself back to lower it, or Pull the finger ahead to Raise it. (It's therefore that the one collar shown for the tooth to push against to lower would be absent, as would the tooth itself).

On the fingers that had to be timed, that was accomplished from the bellcranks number of holes, as well as Short (High Tempered) compression springs, that slid over the ends of the pull rods that had more than one pull to Time. That would then allow the shortest pull to start first and as soon as that pull had hit it's stop, the compression spring would give just enough to allow the longer pull to get to it's stop. (They were also adjustable to where once set, you never had to adjust them again unless you changed string gauges, or added another pull, etc.) Note: "I use to set (time) mine, to where they barely started to compress. (You adjusted those by simply sliding the collar back or ahead on the end of the rod/s) There are none shown in that diagram.

Note: In case of the writing being too small to read.

Top screw is the lowering stop. Bottom screw is the Raise Stop. The Rod with the tooth, is the center Stop (Rest) rod. As I said, that Tooth only needs to be on, for the fingers that both raise and lower. Other than that, the finger simply pushes back to lower, with a rod simply pushing against the finger itself. Also not shown, is the fact that the Collars, that push or pull against the fingers themselves, are slightly rounded so as not to bind (at all) against the finger as it pivots on the axle shaft, through it's rotation. Also, the finger portion for holding the finger (at rest) center, is not simply a hole through the finger. It's an elongated slot, so as to not interfere with the finger at all during it's traveled ark of movement. (Again with the collar being rounded on that end also.

It's therefore (if you study it real good) you'll be able to see how I accomplished getting splits on it as well. Old yes! Out of date? Probably would be considered out of date now, due to so much more these days, with many more pulls, and the ease of adding to, or changing around, than was happening only a few years back.

But then again, you've got to remember what era this was in, that George first designed it. I have no idea how long George had been building pedal steels before I ordered mine off him, in 1968-69.

So, up until last week my same G.E.S. was good to me for all the many years of playing for a living.

Now, that I have a Carter D-10 (8 + 5). I'll give it a good workout and see exactly how well it plays and sounds, as compared. Smile

Rick Barnhart · From: Arizona, USA

Don, you're gonna love that Carter. I've had mine for quite a while. It's a keeper. I ordered a SD-10 Williams, should be here any day...If I keep saying that over and over, it'll come faster. Anyway, nothing wrong with the D-10 carter, but I need a lighter guitar and that Williams is SOOOO pretty, I wanted to try something different. Congratulations.
_________________
Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe.

Danny Bates · From: Fresno, CA. USA

Don, It sounds like that guitar served you well. Don't ever sell it.. In fact, 40 years of use... I'd have it bronzed! Very Happy

I have a feeling your gonna feel like you got out of an old Caddie and slipped behind the wheel of a Lotus sports car. Smile

Those Carter guitars have super fast action and they sound real good. I think Bud designed them to be a pro guitar (without the frills) for a decent price. Of course, if you got some extra bucks, they'll spruce the body way up for you.

Tonewise: They have a nice smooth high end and good body in the sound. The first Carter I ever heard was Bobby Black ... He had a really great country sound.

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Thanks Rick, Congrats on your new Williams as well. Let us know when it arrives..

Thanks Danny, My G.E.S. ought to be bronzed, (or gold plated) she's most definitely been one great steel. I won't ever part with her.

I'm so far, amazed at the ease of additions & change overs afforded by the all pull Carter system. So far, so good..

Thanks again to each of you,
Don

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Update on my Carter.. I've solved any and all problems. Pickups are now in alignment as is all else.

A great tone, after dropping the XR-16's quite a bit lower than I would on most others. They are indeed a very HOT pick up. Lots of bite! And, the farther down I got them, the better they sounded. I finally hit a spot on the way back up, that definitely did it. Too far down, lost some separation on the low strings. But on the way back up, did I ever nail it.

This guitar has tons of sustain, and a great tone to boot.

Thanks for the help on the pictures & things.
She's definitely a keeper!
Don

Mike Schwartzman · From: Maryland, USA

What can I say, Don? I just did the same thing as you.
In my 1st year of psg (it'll be 1 yr. next month) I've started to learn on a BMI S10, and it's been a fine instrument for me, but I've been wanting to try out some of the great modern steels as described here on the forum. My BMI is a 70's model.

So, yesterday my friend and I drove a couple of hours to Billy Cooper's. What a great place, and Mrs. Cooper was as welcoming and as nice as could be! A few of the great brands were not there, but many were there, both new and used. So my my buddy Joe (another new steeler) and I tried out a dozen or maybe 2 dozen steels...all were modern steels and all were SD10's. Some 3x4, some 3x5.

Keep in mind that even though I read a lot here, most folks here are Einsteins compared to me on PSG's. Mechanics were never my long suit anyway. I'm ok with linear stuff like old point to point wired tube amps and electric guitars and basses, but throw another dimension (depth) with moving parts and springs etc., I'll be lost in no time flat.

Good Lord, we tried out some fantastic steels! All of them played with no volume pedal into the same amp with the same settings. If there was a sustain contest...I still don't know who would have won. There were tonal differences but we had to chalk that up to different pickups or strings etc.

Many of the choices were in a similar price range. I made my choice on personal pedal and lever action comfort. I left the shop with a 6 month old Carter SD10. What a day! I'm figuring if I keep learning how to play this thing...I should be broke or divorced (or both)in 2 years...ha ha.
_________________
Emmons Push Pull, BMI, Session 400, Home of the Slimcaster Tele.

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Slim,

Your:

Jamie Lennon · From: Nashville, TN

The Carter is a great guitar
_________________
Mullen Guitars, Little Walter Amps, Benado Effects, D'Addario Strings

www.georgettejones.net

Bo Borland · From: South Jersey -

Don has a new girl! .. what's Helen gonna say?
Way to go Don, we have to get together before it snows.

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Hey Bo Bro, Thanks!

"It's not what she's gonna say.." Laughing

I think you might want to ask her next time ya see her. Very Happy

Update:

She (the steel) has spent the last few days upside down. I like all the pulls dead center (nothing rubbing anything) and all in perfect alignment.

This one has a Quad raise, double lower. I didn't like the nylon tuning nuts (lowers) rubbing against the lower end plate cutouts on the C6, as did a few on the E9th.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Only 3/16"? Personally, I wouldn't even worry about that little bit, as simply turning the guitar over and setting it down puts strain on the cabinet too. However, if you want to try something...

With the guitar upside-down, I'd put the legs on and stretch a bungee cord between the ends of them, enough to pull them together at the ends about an inch. While the bungee cord is still on, loosen the screws holding the endplates at the front of the cabinet, and then re-tighten them. Then remove the bungee cord, and see if the pedal board fits any better. If it does, you can repeat or adjust the above procedure for best results.

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Donny,

Thanks a lot! I'll give that a try. You may be right on the money of exactly where the problem is coming from.

If it was only off a fraction up at the end plate, by the time that transfered down to the bottom of the leg, it would be off by the small amount that it is. "Which really, isn't all that much."

I know I'm too fussy. My wife is always telling me I'm too much of a perfectionist and expect things to be too precise. Very Happy

I'll let you know what I find out.

Don Brown, Sr. · From: New Jersey

Donny,

Thanks a ton! You made a great call on this one.

The (keyhead side) endplate, after it wraps around the front and ends, is "ever so slightly" down from being completely flush with the top of the cabinet.

The only way we could tell, was to feel it. It's therefore, off by the same tiny amount from being even with the bottom edge of the front apron.

The good thing is, there is nothing (at all) in the way (at that end) of having full access to each of the screws.

The slight tension that's on the pedal board may be all the help it will need to align itself.

Thanks again, and a great call!

I'll work on that first thing in the morning. There's nothing any better (especially on pedal steel) than to have things working as close to precision as possible. I've always believed a person only gets out of anything, the amount of time & effort, their willing to put into, whatever it is they're doing.

I owe you!
Don

John Swain · From: Winchester, Va

Don, I have a 2003 Carter D10 I bought new with the xr-16s. I'd be interested to know what your optimum pu height is on E9 and C6..how many dimes or quarter fit btw strings and pus @ string 1 and 10 on each neck..Thanks in advance..JS

Forum Index > Pedal Steel		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic

All times are GMT - 8 Hours	Jump to: