Alternate Diminished 7th chord

Phil Halton · From: Holyoke, Massachusetts, USA

Thought I'd pass along this little discovery I made concerning Diminished7th chords.

Pedals B, C and the lever that lowers the 5th & 10th strings (on my Carter S10 its the LKV lever) will give a nice full diminished chord on strings 5, 4, 3, 2.

Its a nice alternative to dropping back one fret and pressing the E-raise lever.

Its actually a II dim7 instead of the I dim7 you get by use of the E-raise lever method, but that's OK, just drop back 2 frets and press BC&V for an I dim7 chord on strings 5 4 3 & 2.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

This is closely related to the dim7 obtained using A+B plus the E=>Eb and B=>Bb levers - it's the same basic chord, voiced a little differently. The C-lever raises the 4th string E a whole step, while the E=>Eb pedal lowers it a half step, so they both draw notes from the same sequence of minor-third intervals. I probably use these for diminished chords as much as I use the E=>F raise.

Of course, on a stock push-pull, the A-pedal raise overrides the B=>Bb lever lower, so this doesn't work there. For this reason, I am considering changing the B=>Bb lower to a B=>C raise on that guitar, since I use the split to get C a lot more than the Bb alone. That is - when I feel like I've really grokked the basics of making changes on my push-pull - not for the faint of heart all-pull type of guy. Smile

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

If your setup lets you play all 12 notes of the chromatic scale, them you can play all 3 diminished 7th chords at any fret. Some of them may sound sour if your temperament is far from equal.

Bengt Erlandsen · From: Brekstad, NORWAY

As Dave Mudgett said A+B+E's-Eb and B-Bb give a dim7. Strings 8 7 6 5 4 (1) 3
Since I don't have a B-Bb lever I half pedal the A pedal. If I use the Bpedal as a pivot point I found that keeping my ankle steady the twisting of the leg/knee to lower E's to Eb was just enough to release the pressed Apedal halfway. I really like playing a 6th voicing A+B, (str 7 6 5 4) go down 1 fret (half A + B & E's-Eb) then go down another fret and end with E's-Eb with/without the B pedal for a dom7th/6th voicing.

Phil Halton · From: Holyoke, Massachusetts, USA

Dave,

Thanks for that Dim7 voicing using A&B pedals with E-lower & B-lower levers. I think I knew it, but forgot about it because my B-lower and E-lower are on the same knee (with b-lower on a vertical lever) and the move was kind of awkward.--I'll add it to my chord bag for sure.

Hey Bengt, That Half pedal was probably the other reason I avoided that Dim7 voicing, but you're little trick of pivoting on B Pedal with a stiff ankle really works-thanks.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Yeah, I use that A+B+(E=>Eb)+(B=>Bb) dim7 a lot - so I always put the B lower and E=>Eb lower on opposite knees. The ability to do that and still leave B=>Bb on LKV is one of a long line of reasons that I switched the E=>Eb lever from Emmons-style (LKR) to Sho Bud or Paul Franklin style (RKL).

Earnest is certainly right - they're all there on the typical E9 setup with A & B pedals and E=>Eb, E=>F, B=>Bb levers, some way to change either string 6(G#) or 7(F#) to G, and perhaps the D=>Db change on string 9. In string (note) format:

C, D#, F#, A dim7 - 8(D#), 7(F#), 6(A), 5(C), 4(D#), 1(F#) - using A & B pedals and E=>Eb and B=>Bb levers (or a modified version using B & C pedals plus B=>Bb lever, as you point out)

C#, E, G, Bb dim 7 - 10/9(C#), 8(E), 7/6(G), 5(Bb), 2(C#), using either A pedal for string 10 or D=>C# lever on string 9, either a F#=>G or G#=>G change on strings 7 or 6, respectively, and the B=>Bb change on string 5.

D, F, Ab, B dim 7 - 9(low, no D=>Db change), 8(F), 6(Ab), 5(B), 2(high, with D#=>D change), 4(F), using the E=>F lever.

There may be other ways that I haven't mentioned here, but I don't know them.

The way my guitars are configured, that second one (Db, E, G, Bb dim7) is very difficult to reach (I get G on string 6 by splitting the B-pedal with the G#=>F# lever on the same knee as B=>Bb), and it sounds out of tune the way I tune the guitar anyway.

Everything is a tradeoff.

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