OK, why is it..... (high string sounds)

Delvin Morgan · From: Lindstrom, Minnesota, USA

I was just noodling around and I came across this. I played strings 2,3 and 5 with A and B pedals. Then strings 3,4 and 5 with AB and E to Eb lever. They are the same notes,just a different inversion, so why do they sound so different. Is it only me?

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

I can think of several reasons. Any one or all of the following can add to the mystery.

1. String 2 and the 4th string lowered to Eb possibly not being tuned to the exact same note. This is done on purpose by some players.

2. The gauge of the strings are different. Yes, that CAN change the timbre of two different gauge strings tuned to the same note.

3. Their respective locations within the magnetic fields of the PU. Many players have had a problem with the "outside" strings not having the punch of more centrally located strings, and they attribute this to the PU.

But THE most probable cause is:

Few steel players strike the strings with the exact same "power" using different fingers. So it is probably caused by the fact that you are reversing your fingers as you change the grips. And the string you sruck sligthly harder before, is now bringing out a higher level, and vice versa.

There are players who have worked on this for many years. One is Tom Brumley. And it shows. You might think about this and work on it, as you do other things in your trying to get "that" ultimate sound.

In fact, trying to get BOTH of those grips to sound the same, just may be a good thing as your ear brain and hands begin to subconsciously adjust; since you are now aware of it. Whereas before you gave it NO thought.

As to item #2, you might find the following interesting.

Jerry Byrd used 3 "2nds" for his first 3 strings on his C6 lapsteels, so his major 3rds (strings 1 and 2), would have the same feel as his minor 3rds (strings 2 and 3). IE, He wanted his slants on them to sound identical. My ears (at least) attest to the fact he achieved that goal.

After I then did this, I noticed the difference instantly, AND I was able to get some subtle sounds that my ears had been hearing, but heretofore I was not able to get.

Oh for the life of a steel guitar player Very Happy

. But then I am sure that every musical instrument has its own "quirks".

c.
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Clyde Mattocks · From: Kinston, North Carolina, USA

Good post, Carl. By all reports, Jerry was very picky about the timbre of each string for the reasons you cited and would mix and match brands to
get exactly what he was looking.
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Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

Carl, You da man.

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

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Greg Gefell · From: Upstate NY

So Carl, just to clarify. By 3 2nds do you mean all 3 strings were the same gauge but tuned differently? If so I would think the tension difference would be strange, but then I haven't tried this so I don't know.
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Pat Carlson · From: Sutton, Nebraska, R.I.P.

Carl Thank You for your very good and educational answer to Delvin's Post! Very Happy

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The Lone Prairie Steeler Pat

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

Thanks folks,

And yes Greg, the gauges are the same, and I thought JUST as you do. However, I figured that if Jerry did it, there had to be good reason. So I did, and bam, it does make a difference for the better.

One other quirk, All 3 were Gibson 2nd strings for regular guitar, whenever he could find them.

What it did was to make his major thirds sound the SAME when using strings 2 and 3 as it sounded getting that same major third on strings 1 and 2.

And vice versa for minor thirds.

c Smile

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Delvin Morgan · From: Lindstrom, Minnesota, USA

Carl,

I get the string gauge thing, but strings 3 and 5 are constant only 2 and 4 change. And on my Williams the 2nd is .015 and 4th is .014, so not really much difference. It must be how I am striking the strings. I will work on that. Thanks for all your help.

Oh, and when I check strings 2 and 4/w E-Eb with the Peterson tuner the notes are the same.

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

Right on, Carl.........

I'm sitting here at this very moment, staring at a $127.00 box of GIBSON STRINGS.....special order from Texas..... hoping someone will come along and volunteer to install them on my 15+ g'tars, if you know what I mean.

Those string combinations........are what made it virtually impossible to be exactly sure WHAT STRINGS Jerry Byrd was playing on in his thousands of recordings.

His seamless playing, bar slants and slides and different combination of strings is what made his music so fabulously beautiful.

The lable reads: Gibson Strings, .022, Nickel Plated Steel for Electric Guitar.

Lest we forget, Jerry used for many years, on his 4th string in C6th tuning, a Gibson .024 PLAIN string to further enhance the unblemished sound of his top four strings. That's why his reverse slants were nearly impossible to figure out, if you were a true 'student' of his.

And yes, JERRY BYRD DID tune and retune for whatever song he wanted to play. All of this string guage and other negative comments really don't have that much to do with the reality of playing well.

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

Thank you so much Delvin and Ray.

And Ray you are sooo correct about string 4. I decided not to include that info. since it already sounds weird to most players, and I didn't want it to sound even more weird.

But be that as it may, it is a fact. Incidently, I never knew Jerry did this. But I could hear things that were impossible for me to duplicate. I am not talking about Jerry's unequalled dexterity and musical genius.

I was talking about the sound he got if he ONLY plicked 2 notes and let them sustain. So for 40 yrs I wondered what he was doing.

It was only after our mutual friend Wayne Tanner told me about the three "2nds", that it all started to come together. And about the same time, I found a 7 string Rick bakelite Pre war guitar.

When Wayne sent me a set of strings gauged JUST like Jerry recommends, I, for the first time was able to hear things I had NEVER created on any guitar including another prewar Rick.

So Jerry created the saga. Hopefuly others can take this info; and then they too will in all likelyhood realize what we are talking about.

c.
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A broken heart + † = a new heart.

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

Carl.........weren't you an early day member of Millie's original JBFC? That's where I first learned of Jerry's string preferences.

In fact, all of that info' is on my Jerry Byrd - Fan Club.com site, "FREE" for the taking and yet some folks are still wandering around in a haze. No need to, of course.

We've posted some new tunes on the site that should be up and running any hour........now.

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

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