GFI Student Model?

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

A friend of mine has a 70s GFI Student Model with 3 floor pedals and 1 knee lever. He called me the other day and asked if I would be interested in trading a lap steel straight across for it as he finds pedal steel overwhelming. He told me that it has a single coil pickup and he believes it is "push pull".

I really love the sound of pedal steel and this seems like a good way to get my feet wet. I've been playing lap steel for 25 years so I think it could come fairly naturally to me. My question is, would it be worth starting out on the GFI even though it doesn't have as many knee levers as most people suggest? Also, do GFI student models have any known "issues" that I should be aware of?

I should mention that I have not seen the instrument and won't be able to check it out for a few weeks. I just thought I should run it by you guys to see what you have to say. Thanks in advance for any feedback.

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

Id call Bobbe Seymour and ask him,, he can add the other levers and would know if it can be done on an older one. depending on how much the lap-steel is worth I think its a steal! (no-pun intended)
_________________
GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

After thinking about it a bit, I suppose part of my question is this: Will the limitations of having only 1 knee lever make it not worth it? In other words, can you play much with just 3 floor pedals and one knee lever? I'm new to this so I wasn't sure.

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

Michael,

I'm gonna try to give you the best answer that I can muster here.

You could probably play a 3 pedal, 1 knee lever guitar for a whole lifetime, and not ever run out of possibilities, if it was your ambition, and intent to squeeze every little drop of goodness that you could out of it.

The truth though, is this. As you're learning your way around on the (3x1) instrument, you will be constantly hearing neat, fun things elsewhere on radio, recordings, TV shows & jingles...
And, you'll soon become frustrated, as you figure out which strings are moving up or down to create those sounds, and you'll not have the means to reproduce them as you learn.
I believe that emulation of what you hear, along with the ability to to recreate the sounds that develop in your own creative mind are crucial to the early stages of learning.
You'll be much more content if you have the means to do so.
If I was you, I'd spring for a good quality 3x4 (S-10)

Just so you know, I am speaking from my own experience.
I had a "Red Baron" (3x1) for a very, very short time, before I upgraded to a nice little 3x4 (1982).

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

Thank you very much for your honest feedback. What I may do is just borrow the instrument for a while and see if I can wrap my brain around playing pedal steel in the first place. If it seems like a good fit, I'll spring for a better instrument. He was OK me just borrowing it but also said that he would trade straight across for one of my 6 string lap steels if I was interested.

Brian Kurlychek · From: Maine, USA

Michael, I can tell you from (my limited) experience that it is harder than alot of these guys on here make it look, and its easier once you have it in front of you than you think it will be. I got used to the concept pedals and levers right away, but proper muting and technique, well that is gonna take some time.

I don't know if it is because I played guitar for 7 months prior to starting on steel, but at least you don't have to make convoluted shapes with your fingers to get a chord.

I guess what I am saying is it will make more sense once you are sitting there playing it than any amount of watching videos.

Cheers!

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

Dont forget to call Bobbe and see if that is to old to have new levers added. I think its like 120$ per lever, so it may be a great deal for a lap trade.
_________________
GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Bob Blair · From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada

Sounds like a good deal to me. You can go a long way with three pedals and a knee lever that lowers the e's.

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

I've actually got my left and right hand technique down as I've been playing lap steel for many years. It's mostly a matter of getting used to more strings and how to work the pedals. I'll definitely give Bobbe a call once I pick up the instrument.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Aome have said the GFI student models are about as close to a "pro" model guitar as you can get without calling it such. I have a GFI Ultra and have played a couple student models, and thought they were excellent.

The cost of additional knee levers (highly recommended if you're going to go the traditional E9 route) isn't all that much considering the trade deal, and you'd end up with a guitar you really would not have to "trade up" for a LONG time.

GFI's are known for easy maintenance, tremendous stability (the Ultras have no cabinet drop), and a very light weight, which may not seem important but can be really critical, especially if you need to put it away now and then. They also have a rather distinctive tone I equate to a classic Fender, but with more modern sustain.

Sounds like a great deal to me.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

Thank you for the comments on GFI steels. It looks like I really don't have much to lose.

Brett Day · From: Pickens, SC

GFI started in 1989. I now play a GFI Ultra D-10 and it's an amazing guitar.

Brett

Paul Redmond · From: Illinois, USA

A few years ago, I put a 'short-Uni' tuning on a guitar for Will Roberts of Eldena IL. It had only the 3 and 1 factory setup. I added two more KL's for him. It was easy and accurate. That system is a single-finger pull/release system. I was able to give him his E drops, his E to F raises, and the B to D on the 9th string. It has the standard three FP's. It plays well and I would play a gig with it and that tuning any day of the week. If the price is right, well.....!!!
PRR

Casey Lowmiller · From: Kansas

I believe that most of Winnie Winston's book requires 3 pedals and 1 knee lever...I might be wrong as I don't have it infront of me right now.

If I am correct, that will get you started & then some. Later on, if you can add knee levers to it, I think you'll be set.

Of course, it also depends on what kind of lap steel is involved in the trade.

Casey
_________________
Known Coast to Coast as
"The Man with The Plan"

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Casey - Winnie's book requires 2 knees. That's what was so frustrating the first time I tried to learn (and there were NO instructors I could locate in L.A. in the 80's). I knew a couple of other guys with Mavericks who also quickly bailed out when they found out beginner instruments were not complete enough to play the most basic instructional material - which is pretty silly when you think about it. In those days, Winnie's book was the ONLY book you could find out here, and the only "student" guitars didn't have enough equipment to play through the book.

There'd probably be a LOT more steel players on the west coast (and probably elsewhere) if the steel manufacturers had paid the smallest bit of attention to what was available in the way of instructional materials. and after all these years, it STILL hasn't changed much! With the exception of the Carter Starter (there might be another one or two) builders still make 3/1 beginner guitars that are essentially useless with the existing books.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

Bob Blair · From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada

Jim, who still makes a 3/1 student guitar? I didn't think anyone did any more.

I don't recall it being hard to adapt the Winston book to the limitations of my old Sidekick. I could see what I was missing by not being able to raise the E's, and compensated a bit by doing slants and stuff. When I got a 3 and 4 guitar I knew exactly what to do with that lever. But the biggest changes for me when I got my first pro guitar were the sound and the mechanics.

It's true that instructional material was scarce back in the late 70's when I was starting out. I had something else as well as the Winston book - maybe a Mel Bay book or something? And there was some instructional stuff that you would find in music stores that was throughly dated - might have been hanging around for years.

Jody Sanders · From: Magnolia,Texas, R.I.P.

Michael, The GFI is a very high quality guitar, The student model is no exception. Jody.

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

I picked up the steel yesterday. It turns out that it is an MSA Sidekick. I can see that I will definitely need to upgrade in the long run but it's pretty cool. I really haven't spent much time with it yet but I think that my worries about taking up the pedal steel are unfounded. The tight string spacing isn't really an issue and even the amount of strings isn't as confusing as I expected. I guess all of those years playing lap steel is paying off. I just downloaded the manual from another post here and plan to start my journey tonight.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Well, unfortunately there's (IMO) a huge difference between a Sidekick and a GFI Student. You might not want to spend money on knee lever additions in this case...
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

Michael Papenburg · From: Oakland, CA

Yeah, I realized that pretty much right away. While I was previously interested in trading for the steel, I'm now looking at it as something I'm borrowing for a while. The good thing is that it is answering some questions for me and I'm already getting the hang of it. I'll probably be investing in a pro level instrument by the end of the year.

The only issue I've come across is that I'm not sure how to make the steel high enough for my knees while using a volume pedal. It's fine if I don't use one but a little too low with the pedal. It seems like there is a limit to how high you can raise the steel because of the length of the bars going to the a, b & c pedals. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Forum Index > Pedal Steel		Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic