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Topic: What tone bar do you use? |
Phil Sikes
From:
Greenbank, WA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 9:52 am |
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Howdy everyone, I just got my new to me Beard Road-O-Phonic and am having a ball using my pedal steel bar but I would like to try a shubb type dobro bar also. What are you using and why? There is a bewildering array of bars out there and a poor guy could go broke trying them out. I will be playing this as both a lap steel and dobro at times.
Thanks for the assistance.
Phil
_________________
Beard Jerry Douglas Signature, RBA B Bender Tele, Larrivee OM60, Kanile'a Super Tenor Ukulele, Kala U-Bass, Fishman Loudbox Mini and Nechville Saturn banjos. |
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Fred Kinbom
From:
Berlin, Germany, via Stockholm, Sweden.
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 10:15 am
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Two words (or is it one?  ): Tribo-Tone.
If you're already comfortable with a bullet bar, I see no reason why you should get a "handle" bar. Pull-offs work with bullet bars too, they sound better, and you can do "dog tail slants" with the nose (of the bar ).
My 2 cents.
Fred
_________________
www.fredrikkinbom.com - New lap steel album out now - listen here: fredrikkinbom.bandcamp.com/album/songs-for-lap-steel-and-harmonium
Last edited by Fred Kinbom on 4 Apr 2008 10:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Edward Meisse
From:
Santa Rosa, California, USA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 10:17 am
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I use a Brozophonic almost exclusively. It gets great tone out of the acoustic guitars, it fits my hand perfectly and is great for single string work on my electrics. I'll bet that it would also be quite good on a long scale electric. But I use a Jerry Byrd bar on my short scale S8 Remington for tunes where I do alot of slanting. The greater ease of use is especially appearant in doing reverse slants. There has been alot of talk on the forum about the various bars. I suggest a search.
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Amor vincit omnia |
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Todd Weger
From:
Safety Harbor, FLAUSA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 10:51 am Tribo Tone
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Phil -- Fred does a really nice sound comparison of a variety of bars in a video at the Tribo Tone sight. The beautiful piece of music and his execution while demonstrating the bars is just icing on the cake! Definitely check it out:
http://www.tribotone.com/
That said, I just don't have a the dough for more bars right now, but I am going to get one of them soon enough.
For now, I really enjoy using either a Jim Dunlop "JB" 919 (2.75" x 3/4" 4.5oz) bar or the slightly longer/heavier 918 (2-15/16" x 3/4" 5.5oz). I like 'em 'cuz they're stainless steel, inexpensive and can be found almost anywhere. I pop out the plastic ends for more thumb control.
I also have a couple 2-3/4" long x 3/4" to 5/8" at the tip tapered bars that I really like. I seem to get the best control with these bars, when playing single note stuff in particular.
Good luck. I personally like a round nose bar myself, but it's what I started with, so mostly habit I suppose.
_________________
Todd James Weger --
1956 Fender Stringmaster T-8 (C6, E13, A6); 1960 Fender Stringmaster D-8 (C6, B11/A6); Custom-made 25" aluminum cast "fry pan" with vintage Ricky p'up (C6); 1938 Epiphone Electar (A6); 1953 Oahu Tonemaster; assorted ukuleles; upright bass |
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basilh
From:
United Kingdom
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Keith Cordell
From:
San Diego
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 12:14 pm
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| Not that I should be correcting anyone about techniques, but pull offs CAN'T sound better or cleaner with a bullet bar. I agree that many techniques are extremely difficult with Stevens-derived bars but they are designed to make pull offs clean and articulate. I use bullet bars and the Dunlop Lap Dawg bars, and they each serve a very distinct purpose; the songs with pull offs are Lap Dawg tunes. everything else I use the Red Rajah on. |
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Fred Kinbom
From:
Berlin, Germany, via Stockholm, Sweden.
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 12:30 pm
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Keith, I did not say that pull-offs were "better" or "cleaner" with a bullet bar, I just said that they work with a bullet bar too. Tone bars are a very subjective matter and there are no rights or wrongs, just opinions. I started out with "handle" bars, but since I got hooked on bullet bars I feel my E.G. Smith bar to be awkward compared to the round bars whenever I pick it up, and to my ears, the tone of bullet bars is much better. Just my opinion. Handle-type bars are obviously the preference among bluegrass Dobro players.
Todd - many thanks for the nice comment about my tone bar comparison!  It's very encouraging that you like my playing. 
Fred
_________________
www.fredrikkinbom.com - New lap steel album out now - listen here: fredrikkinbom.bandcamp.com/album/songs-for-lap-steel-and-harmonium |
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Keith Cordell
From:
San Diego
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 1:46 pm
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"Pull-offs work with bullet bars too, they sound better"
I misuderstood your sentence, Fred. Sorry. I agree with you on most of your other points though, and I certainly love hearing what you have posted on myspace.
BTW I am also a budding percussionist and I have to plug your brother? on his excellent instruments. I hope they become available here in the states, I'd love to have one. Quite impressive. |
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Fred Kinbom
From:
Berlin, Germany, via Stockholm, Sweden.
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 2:49 pm
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| Keith Cordell wrote: |
"Pull-offs work with bullet bars too, they sound better"
I misuderstood your sentence, Fred. Sorry. I agree with you on most of your other points though, and I certainly love hearing what you have posted on myspace.
BTW I am also a budding percussionist and I have to plug your brother? on his excellent instruments. I hope they become available here in the states, I'd love to have one. Quite impressive. |
Ahh - now I understand! English is not my native language, so I sometimes don't notice subtle potential misreading "thingies" like that.
Thanks for the nice words about my music and about my brother's instruments! I was recently at the Frankfurt Musikmesse (the NAMM of Europe) working with him, and it went great. If you want a PDF version of the new catalogue, drop me an e-mail. My brother was approached by several distributors in Frankfurt, but until things are set up in the US, you can always order direct from me (and I would of course give you the best deal possible).
Sorry to sidetrack - back to tone bars! Have a good weekend everyone!
Fred
_________________
www.fredrikkinbom.com - New lap steel album out now - listen here: fredrikkinbom.bandcamp.com/album/songs-for-lap-steel-and-harmonium |
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Steinar Gregertsen
From:
Arendal, Norway, R.I.P.
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 2:54 pm
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I have a large collection of tone bars, but for the last 3/4 year or so I've never used anything else than the Tribo Tone.
Steinar
_________________
"Play to express, not to impress"
Website - YouTube |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 3:08 pm
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I have many bars, as well, but I really like the Jim Burden bars that he made for me and my Dunlop pedal steel bars. Usually, I'll play with whatever I grab. Picks are the things I'm way more fussy about.
Gonna have to try one of those Tribo Tones.
_________________
Links to streaming music, websites, YouTube: Links
Last edited by Mike Neer on 4 Apr 2008 4:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Phil Sikes
From:
Greenbank, WA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 4:18 pm
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Those Tribo Tones sound great! Thanks for the input guys. I wasn't looking for one best, just what everyone is using so I can narrow my search down. Until I can decide which to go with first I will keep using my George L 3/4 inch bullet nose. It seems to work good enough for my playing abilities which ain't nothin' to write home about.
Thanks - Phil
_________________
Beard Jerry Douglas Signature, RBA B Bender Tele, Larrivee OM60, Kanile'a Super Tenor Ukulele, Kala U-Bass, Fishman Loudbox Mini and Nechville Saturn banjos. |
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Terry Farmer
From:
Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 7:13 pm
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| I recently got a TriboTone. Best bar on the market IMHO. I ordered a spare! |
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Andy Sandoval
From:
Bakersfield, California, USA
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 10:45 pm
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| How do you do a pull off with a bullet bar? Do you have to use the flat end? |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 4 Apr 2008 10:59 pm
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I use the John Pearse Hawaiian Guitar bar
(Length: 2-7/8" Diameter: 3/4" Weight: 5.2 oz)
quite a bit. I also like my Tribo-tone. I used the tribo tone tonight because I just changed strings and it calmed the string noise down a bit.
John Pearse makes great bars and they are not too expensive. I will try out a BJS Hawaiian bar sometime soon also.
The pull offs on a round nose bar are different than square edge bars. They are different sounds. Some guys flip the round nose bar around to get the right type of sound.
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Bob |
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Bill Leach
From:
Cheshire, england
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 12:53 am
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You get more attack with a pull off with a stevens type bar than with a bullet bar, which suits blue grass style more. I don't play blue grass so I use a tribo tone bullet.
I started with a dunlop bullet but it soon developed grooves which hasn't happened to the tribo tone so far. I did some blind tests with my various bars with non steel playing friends and they all picked out the tribo tone as sounding the best - it seems to have a fuller tone.
As for shubbs, I used an SP2 for some time. This tries to be the best of both worlds, it has the groove handle , a bullet on one end and a pointy stevens type thing at the other. I found I only ever used the bullet end and the soft chrome would develop grooves within a few months hard playing. I think it's a good beginner's bar though as it's not as expensive a some, lighter,easier to use than a bullet, and you can decide whether to go for the bullet or the stevens. |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 2:25 am
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My favorites in descending order:
1. Tribo-Tone (My favorite)
2. John Pearse Thermo-Cryonic
3. Dunlop JB
4. Black Phoenix
5. Pedal Steel bar (I sold all these but wish I'd kept them)
Bars are like flatpicks; it absolutely depends on personal preference. My opinion is that practically every technique used on a steel guitar is easier with a bullet-style bar with the exception of fast pull-off/hammer-on flurries. A Stevens-type bar and all its modern variation make slants more difficult and less accurate. Certain techniques - like playing strings 3 & 4 with the nose of the bar while all the other strings ring open - are impossible without a bullet. It had been years since I tired one so I bought a nice high-end rail bar a few years back. 'Felt like I had an anchor on my hand and immediately sold it. That said, players like Mike Auldridge and Jerry Douglas use variations on the Stevens design and their playing loses absolutely nothing. On the other hand, Pete Grant plays incredible Dobro with a pedal steel bar so ...(see first sentence). As JB used to say, it's what you do with what you got that counts. |
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basilh
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 2:31 am
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OK !
Last edited by basilh on 5 Apr 2008 2:53 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Todd Weger
From:
Safety Harbor, FLAUSA
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 8:19 am Manly Men...
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| basilh wrote: |
| Whereas if they persevered and used the "Man's" bar, they'd learn much more about technique and patience.. |
_________________
Todd James Weger --
1956 Fender Stringmaster T-8 (C6, E13, A6); 1960 Fender Stringmaster D-8 (C6, B11/A6); Custom-made 25" aluminum cast "fry pan" with vintage Ricky p'up (C6); 1938 Epiphone Electar (A6); 1953 Oahu Tonemaster; assorted ukuleles; upright bass |
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Edward Meisse
From:
Santa Rosa, California, USA
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 9:59 am
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Yeah!!! The Man's bar, by god!! I wouldn't be caught with anything else. 
_________________
Amor vincit omnia |
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Mark Mansueto
From:
Michigan, USA
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 10:40 am
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Guys, there's a reason that bluegrass players and guys like Kelly Joe Phelps use a Steven's type bar. For their style of playing it's obviously a better choice. I'm outnumbered in what's turned out to be a debate but I use a handle type bar for the majority of what I play.
Phil, what style of music do you plan to play with your Beard? If the answer is bluegrass then I would recommend at least trying something like a Shubb, you might like it once you get the feel of it. Like the others have said, it's not that you can't play bluegrass with a bullet bar but I don't. For playing pull-off style and fast single note stuff I highly prefer either my custom made handle style bar or a modified Shubb GS. I do agree that it's easier to do reverse slants with a bullet bar and that's what I like about them but IMO that's where the advantage ends.
Don't believe that it's impossible to do split slants without a bullet bar because I do split slants and dog leg minor chords with the slightly rounded end of my Shubb. Granted, it's not as easy as using a bullet but with practice it's not a problem.
_________________
https://markmansueto.bandcamp.com/
https://open.spotify.com/artist/65dQ3EyZC2RaqawA8gPlRy?si=dOdqc5zxSKeJI9cISVVx_A |
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basilh
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 1:27 pm
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Ok
Last edited by basilh on 5 Apr 2008 2:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Roman Sonnleitner
From:
Vienna, Austria
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 1:35 pm
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| Mark Mansueto wrote: |
Don't believe that it's impossible to do split slants without a bullet bar because I do split slants and dog leg minor chords with the slightly rounded end of my Shubb. Granted, it's not as easy as using a bullet but with practice it's not a problem. |
+1 - I use a Shubb Pearse SP2 mainly (though I do occasionally use a plexi-glass bullet bar, mainly for its different tone), and with the rounded nose of the SP2, split-slants ar no problem at all - after all, the underside of an SP2 is like the lower half of a bullet bar, just with a handle on top - why should there be a difference? |
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Steinar Gregertsen
From:
Arendal, Norway, R.I.P.
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 1:57 pm
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| Roman Sonnleitner wrote: |
+1 - I use a Shubb Pearse SP2 mainly (though I do occasionally use a plexi-glass bullet bar, mainly for its different tone), and with the rounded nose of the SP2, split-slants ar no problem at all - after all, the underside of an SP2 is like the lower half of a bullet bar, just with a handle on top - why should there be a difference? |
Same here, I had no problems doing split slants with the rounded end of the SP2. It was the reverse slants that felt impossible.
I think Stacy Phillips is a very good example of how anything's possible with enough practice, he's doing wild slants in 'all directions' with a regular Stevens bar. But there's no doubt it's a lot easier with a bullet bar..
Steinar
_________________
"Play to express, not to impress"
Website - YouTube |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 5 Apr 2008 3:21 pm
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You can play this D minor chord with a Stevens-type bar? Really? I guess I stand corrected.
| Tab: |
D _______0________
A _______0________
F# _______3________
D _______3________
A _______0________
D _______0________
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