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Topic: E9 with 4 pedals? |
Landon Johnson
From:
Washington, USA
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 4:09 pm |
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Hi,
I have seen some pix of E9 S-10s with 4 pedals - what is the fourth pedal typically used for?
Just curious, as I can't play even with just 3... I did a search but found no answer.
Thjanks,
LJ |
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Landon Johnson
From:
Washington, USA
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 4:16 pm sorry, not Nordic...
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I meant to say, "Thanks"
LJ |
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Jerry Hayes
From:
Virginia Beach, Va.
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 4:50 pm
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Landon, some use what's called the "Franklin" pedal which pulls about 3 or 4 strings but I'm not really sure what they are.........
Other's like b0b, Tom Brumley, & myself move our regular pedals to the right one slot and put a change on pedal 1 which raises the 7th string F# to G# and the 10th string B to C#.
Still others will have a pedal 1 that lowers strings 3 and 6 G# to G and also the 11th string G# if you've got a 12 string.........JH in Va.
_________________
Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!! |
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Larry Strawn
From:
Golden Valley, Arizona, R.I.P.
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 6:30 pm 4th pedal
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Landon,
I've got the Franklin pull on my 4th pedal, lowers 5,6,&10 a full step.
Still working on phrasing for that pedal.
Forumite Tony Prior had some nice clips out a while back, and some good forum post concerning the use of this pedal and pull.
Larry 
_________________
Carter SD/10, 4&5 Hilton Pedal, Peavey Sessions 400, Peavey Renown 400, Home Grown Eff/Rack
"ROCKIN COUNTRY" |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 6:55 pm
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| I like 6th string G# to ++A# on pedal 0. |
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Michael Douchette
From:
Gallatin, TN (deceased)
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 29 Aug 2007 7:39 pm
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My 4th. pedal Lowers #2 (½-tone), Raises #6 (½-tone) and Raises #10 (1-tone)! Oops, it's on the C6-Neck! hee~hee! I used to use 4-pedals on the E9. I Raised #1 (1-tone) and #2 (½-tone) on P-1 and then P2-(A), P3-(B), P4-(C). On my present guitar P1 position is Empty and then P2, P3, P4 = (A)-(B)-(C). It's just more comfortable that way!
_________________
<marquee> Go~Daddy~Go, (No), Go, It's your Break Time</marquee> L8R, jb
My T-10 Remington Steelmaster |
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Paul Redmond
From:
Illinois, USA
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 1:48 am
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Moved FP 1, 2, and 3 changes over one notch and added the G# to G drop on 3, 6, and 10 (10 is a G#, not a B on my guitars). Pedals are Emmons order. That drop can be used to give you an on-position minor, or as a "6th-sounding" IV-7th chord from the open position. It's also great for minor descending scales AND for Mooney stuff. It can also be used in place of the usual FP 2 and 3 when playing I, IIm, IIIm, IV walkups and walkdowns 'on position'.
PRR |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 3:51 am
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Great pedal in it's most simple form.
here's a sound file that I did a while back for a forum pal who was considering the P4 on a new Steel.
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mp3 below
These are some very basic phrases but tell a great story...
Trust me I am no expert on these phrases but I have spent a bunch of seat time and learned the phrasing and tonality so I can use some of these phrases in auto pilot.
pay no attention to the out of tune of pitchy stuff, I did this one morning at about 6 Am for Stephen as he was getting ready to order his new Steel.
I think every E9th Steel should have this 5,6 and 10 lower.
here ya go
http://www.tprior.com/R1_0055.MP3
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Once a player understands the tonality and phrasing of these string grips and the lowering of them the options are endless. You have to THINK ahead of the phrase.
tp |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 7:20 am
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That's a really nice little demo, Tony.
One thing I don't understand.
The "Franklin" 4th pedal lowers 5, 6 and 10 a whole tone. The standard "C" 3rd pedal raises 4 and 5 a whole tone.
What happens to the 5th string when you use them together? Is it in tune (to a B note), or is it simply a pedal combination that everyone avoids?
I don't feel the need for such a pedal in my own music, but I understand that a lot of players in top 40 country bands need to copy Paul's licks. Whatever promotes the steel guitar in live music is okay by me. 
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 8:07 am
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Well bob, evidently I'm in the camp of avoidance !
I've never even tried it..never thought of it..
unit now that is..
there are two pedals in between the two on my Steel, A and B..
I just tried it..( two feet )
on my steel..it ain't purty 
each B pull on it's own is in tune but when used with the other ..it ain't...
I guess your technical mind is still in operation, mine stopped functioning decades ago..I remember some of the 60's though  |
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Larry Strawn
From:
Golden Valley, Arizona, R.I.P.
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 8:41 am
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| b0b wrote: |
| What happens to the 5th string when you use them together? Is it in tune (to a B note) |
 Even though the FP is new to me, I can answer that question! 
Lets say I've been working very hard not to hit the two of them together!! 
Larry
_________________
Carter SD/10, 4&5 Hilton Pedal, Peavey Sessions 400, Peavey Renown 400, Home Grown Eff/Rack
"ROCKIN COUNTRY" |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 9:19 am
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| Michael Douchette wrote: |
I ain't tellin' what my 4th pedal does... it sure isn't a Franklin pedal...  |
Michael,
Now you got me really curious. I am in the process of putting the PF change on my home-built and then you come along and say you SURE don't have that change!
Come on..pretty please? |
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John Bechtel
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, R.I.P.
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 9:42 am
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I don't have the “Franklin Change” either, but; perhaps P3 & P4 combined would cause the necessity for a split-pedal adjustment on string #5. (Just a wild guess.)
_________________
<marquee> Go~Daddy~Go, (No), Go, It's your Break Time</marquee> L8R, jb
My T-10 Remington Steelmaster |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 10:03 am
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Michael won't say what that 4th pedal does because, according to the grapevine, it's hooked up to a phasor inside his guitar  ...set to stun!
So, don't get too close to his guitar while you're a drinkin' and a dancin'!!  
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Best regards,
Mike |
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Jonathan Cullifer
From:
Gallatin, TN
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 12:06 pm
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My 4th pedal used to lower 5 & 10 a half step (same as a lot of people have on the vertical lever). My vertical lever raises 1 and 7 a half step. Very useful change.
I recently changed my 4th pedal to the Franklin pedal as I was not using the 5 & 10 lower enough, and I figured out ways around using it. |
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Jimmie Brown
From:
Fayetteville, NC, USA
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 3:20 pm pedal 4
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About a year ago i installed pedal 4 on my Fessy and tried some different things but soon discovered that i could never learn enough on the three that i had so i removed it.
I admire one steeler that seems to get by with only three and his last name is Green, enough said!
Jimmie |
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Duane Reese
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Posted 30 Aug 2007 8:35 pm Earnest Bovine's pedal
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Earnest Bovine wrote:
| Quote: |
| I like 6th string G# to ++A# on pedal 0. |
Now what could possess someone to have such a weird change? I can tell you exacly. If you are an S-10 player that can do nearly everything that a C6 does on E9, except for the #8 pedal function, you'd love this Earnest's pedal. With split grips, you can make just about everything happen, but some things aren't all that smooth, like the #7 and #4 pedal equivalents. If you had this zero pedal, you could "bounce" it like you could a #4 pedal by itself, and also like a #7 pedal when used with the A pedal.
To summarize, when you are doing C6 stuff with your E's lowered, it would be your Maj7 pedal. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 31 Aug 2007 1:34 am
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Anytime you can add a new dimension ( expression ) to your own playing, aka; this 4th pedal..it is a huge personal advantage.
Just because someone else doesn't do it or have it available on there guitar is not a factor.
ex;
two players of similar skill level playing the same song side by side.
Player A has 3 peds, Player B has 4.
Player B can do all the things player A can do...but also has the means to go beyond that point should he choose to.
One of these players has the ability to express beyond the norm, beyond the typical, beyond the expected. |
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Michael Douchette
From:
Gallatin, TN (deceased)
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 31 Aug 2007 4:18 am
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Michale, who said I was talking about Loyd ?
We all know who he is and what he can do...I know I do...
Considering that Loyd does not drop his 4th string on a lever has nothing to do with what WE as individuals may seek to play...or how..
Loyd is Loyd, Buddy is Buddy, PF is PF..you are you..etc....
I'm who I am..
I think for anyone to say "I don't need this because player X doesn't have it is doing themselves a disservice"
Each of us see things differently, hear things differently and may approach things differently.
thats all I am saying.
Why place yourself in a box and lock it ?
tp
Last edited by Tony Prior on 31 Aug 2007 4:30 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Michael Douchette
From:
Gallatin, TN (deceased)
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Posted 31 Aug 2007 4:23 am
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Tony, I didn't say you were speaking about any one player in particular. I just cited him as an example of how the number of pedals we have is not the determining factor in what we are capable of accomplishing as "individuals may seek to play...or how."
I think you missed my point. It's really early, though, and I'm having a bit of a tough time right now. Sorry if I seem gnarly. I don't mean to be.
_________________
Mikey D... H.S.P.
Music hath the charm to soothe a savage beast, but I'd try a 10mm first.
http://www.steelharp.com
http://www.thesessionplayers.com/douchette.html
(other things you can ask about here)
http://s117.photobucket.com/albums/o54/Steelharp/ |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 31 Aug 2007 4:36 am
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Michael, I understand exactly what you are saying and I agree.
you are not gnarly...
My position is just don't lock yourself down .
Our Instrument has really grown the past couple of decades, lots of possibilities, lots of really fine advanced players to draw off of. Many different styles and approaches to gain influence from.
tp |
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Max W. Thompson
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 31 Aug 2007 8:38 am
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Well, I've got a really gnarly psg with 4 pedals and the 4th one lowers the 9th string 1/2 step to C#, which in combination with the "A" pedal next to it (Day setup) gives a real full minor chord.
I also like to use it with the "B" pedal down to change the D Major chord on 9, 7, & 6 to an F# minor chord on the same grip.
My guitar came set up this way, and I haven't learned everything I can do with it the way it is, so I haven't started changing it around yet. |
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Jerry Hayes
From:
Virginia Beach, Va.
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Posted 1 Sep 2007 6:55 am
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Landon, the last few years I had my old ShoBud S-12 I had a minimal Universal tuning which just used 4 floor pedals and 5 knee levers it went like this (tuned high to low) F# D# G# E B G# F# E B G# E B:
Pedal 1....Regular A pedal, raised strings 5 and 9, B's to C#
Pedal 2....usual B pedal, raised strings 3, 6, and 10, G#'s to A
Pedal 3....Raised string 5 B to C# and raised string 6 G# to A#...
Pedal 4....lowered string 7 F# to F, raised string 11 E to F, and raised string 12 B to C#.
I got the "Boo-Wah" thing on LKL by lowering string 5 to A#, raising string 9 B to C, lowering string 11 E to D#, and lowering string 12 B to G#. There were 4 pulls on that lever but on the old 'bud it worked easily!
LKV......raised string 4 E to F# and lowered string 9 B to A#...
LKR......Lowered the 2nd and 8th strings to D.
RKL.....raised strings 4 & 8 E's to F.
RKR.....lowered the 2nd string to C# and the 4th and 8th E strings to D#.
I tried something similar on my BMI a while back but the levers became very stiff with more than two pulls on them............JH in Va.
_________________
Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!! |
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