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Topic: 7 string tuning and gauges |
Darrell Urbien
From:
Echo Park, California
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Posted 22 Aug 2007 11:05 pm |
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OK, so there've been nice replies to the 6 and 8 string threads... Might as well have a go... Can anyone help me out?
I have a 1930s 7 string Audiovox, 22.75" scale. I enjoy listening to both Hawaiian and Western Swing music, and would like to learn how to play both kinds of steel.
I'm learning to play acoustic steel on a Weissenborn clone in low bass G. When I bought the Audiovox, it was strung with bronze (?) acoustic guitar strings with a very thin 7th - some sort of reentrant tuning? Should I just leave the 7th slot empty and tune to some variant of low bass G to help ease my learning curve? Or should I use all 7 strings and learn a new tuning?
If the latter, what tuning and strings would you recommend? Is there a good 7 string tuning for both styles I like? Do I just buy an 8 string set and leave off one string, or do I assemble a custom set of singles?
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John Bushouse
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Posted 23 Aug 2007 6:35 am
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That 7th string is reentrant - I chose to think of it as the 4th string (i.e., G7 would be fDGDGBD L-H, with the f a whole step lower than the third string G). My 1937 National had the same setup, and my steel teacher from several years ago had his set up the same way (Al Dodge of Cheap Suit Serenaders). I had the nut redone so the 7th string is the heaviest.
I buy b0b's set of high bass A and buy a low E separately. I use these strings for for E6 (EBC#EG#BE), A (EAC#EAC#E), A6 (EAC#F#AC#E) (drop all notes a whole step to get the equivalent G tunings). |
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Edward Meisse
From:
Santa Rosa, California, USA
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Posted 23 Aug 2007 6:54 pm
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Jerry Byrd's 7 string tuning was (from high to low) E-C-A-G-E-C#-C. I thought he usually sounded pretty good.  |
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Darrell Urbien
From:
Echo Park, California
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Posted 23 Aug 2007 10:52 pm
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Hi, thanks for the replies. I think I'll try John's Allan Dodge tuning first, since the nut and bridge are already cut for these types of strings.
I measured the existing strings (which I again think are acoustic guitar stings with PB windings) and I come out with (7th to 1st) .012, .053, .044, .035, .025, .013, .011. The thing is detuned now, so I have no idea what the last owner was doing with these sizes. Can anything be done with these, or should I just scrap them altogether?
Both the nut and the bridge on this guitar are metal and notched specifically for a high 7th string - and the 1st and 7th string notches are about a millimeter away from the edges of the nut, really close! I'm assuming I'm going to have to have a new nut fabbed if I'm going to try the other low 7th string tunings. What material would you suggest for this purpose?
I had assumed this steel was tuned in a way similar to what Paul/Bud Tutmarc and/or Sol Hoopii would've used, but I'm not quite so sure now. I don't remember reading anything about reentrant tunings. Any Tutmarc/Hoopii scholars out there know? |
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Edward Meisse
From:
Santa Rosa, California, USA
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Posted 24 Aug 2007 7:14 am
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| Excuse ignorance please. What does, "reentrant," mean in this context? |
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Darrell Urbien
From:
Echo Park, California
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Posted 24 Aug 2007 11:56 am
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Maybe I'm using the word incorrectly, but I've always thought it meant a tuning that is not strictly low-to-high in pitch order (with strings getting thinner as they move away from the player). Classic example is the standard my-dog-has-fleas uke tuning where the fourth string is higher than the third.
Here, my steel is set up with a thin 7th, and I was wondering how to tune and play it. John suggested a reentrant (or I suppose more accurately, "re-entrant") G7 tuning - though I'm not sure what gauges I'm supposed to use for that tuning on my 22.75" guitar - the same ones for the A tunings? |
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Alan Brookes
From:
Brummy living in Southern California
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Posted 24 Aug 2007 2:58 pm
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| Edward Meisse wrote: |
| Excuse ignorance please. What does, "reentrant," mean in this context? |
On most instruments, the strings go from high to low in progression. In a re-entrant tuning the strings will go from high to lower, up again, and then down again. There are many re-entrant tunings, the most famous being the ukelele, some citterns, some mountain dulcimers, and the pedal-steel E9.
Take the regular guitar, which is tuned (low to high)..
E A D' G' B'' E''
This is not reentrant because every string is higher than the one to the left of it.
If you were to take the fourth string off and replace it with a first string, tuned an octave higher than normal, it would become..
E A D'' G' B'' E''
This is reentrant because the D string is higher than the G string next to it. |
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Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
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Posted 25 Aug 2007 8:50 am Hummmmmmmmmmmmmm?
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| WHAT did he say? |
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Chuck Fisher
From:
Santa Cruz, California, USA * R.I.P.
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Posted 28 Aug 2007 2:59 pm
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I'm not sure Ray, but I think he's cussin us....
And I was just going to recommend E major with a 5th below added, like a .058 tuned B, nice for alternating bass w/arpeggios. |
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Chris Scruggs
From:
Nashville, Tennessee, USA
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Posted 28 Aug 2007 5:28 pm
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well, seeing as you want to play hawaiian and western swing, you really do need to use a 6th tuning. C6 or A6 would probably work the best.
i agree with edward,jerry byrd's c6/a7 is my personal preference!
cs |
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